56 



also in employing thousands of women for teaching, and many other 

 developments in our educational system will absorb a large number 

 of women. There are some employments not suitable for women ; 

 but bad conditions in factories are largely due to the apathy of the 

 workers themselves. There is no reason why the conditions of the 

 bulk of employments should not be made so good that they would 

 be quite fit for women. 



MR. H. E. CLAY (Leeds Trades Council) : I think that the position 

 taken up by the London and Provincial Vehicle Workers' Union, 

 to which Dr. Phillips referred, was a fairly sensible one that is, first, 

 to secure the reinstatement of all old employees and, second, to argue 

 that the conditions are of such a nature that the job is unsuitable for 

 women. In this district, and more especially in Leeds, in normal times, 

 there are duties extending over a period of 14 to 16 hours, and men 

 have to turn out at 3-15 a.m., and sometimes earlier, to get to work ; 

 in certain cases they get two meals in about three hours, and then go 

 eight hours before another meal. Taking this into consideration, 

 and the stress of weather, I would not like my wife or sister to be 

 employed at it. The conditions are wrong, but the conditions are 

 in existence ; and if women remain in the industry for a protracted 

 period it will have a bad effect on future generations. I do not agree 

 with total exclusion if women are paid the same wages as men for the 

 same work, but this is not the case in any town in the country. I have 

 a return from 90 towns where women are employed ; in some towns 

 they are getting the same rate, but less bonus ; in the North, generally, 

 they start at the men's minimum and stop there. There are 11,000 

 women at present in tramway work, and this will constitute a serious 

 question for the men. We have no complaint except from the purely 

 physical point of view, if they are treated not as women but as tramway 

 conductors. 



Miss B. THOMAS (Postal and Telegraph Clerks' Association) : I wish 

 to dissociate myself from many of Mr. Newlove's remarks. In my 

 opinion, the State are not paying the higher rates of pay earned by 

 women nowadays. The only thing the men are entitled to do is to 

 organise and to see that women do not undercut wages, and then the 

 most efficient men or women will get the posts. 



MR. EDGERTOX (London Society of Compositors) : Dr. Phillips has 

 been quite candid in telling us what exactly is at the back of women's 

 minds respecting the Government's pledge that trade union rules 

 should be reinstated after the war. This is the first time the women's 

 advocates have told us plainly and clearly that this cannot be, and 

 apparently they are going to see that the Government does not keep 

 its pledge. There is one great danger : the trade unions who were 

 responsible for the pledge are very much depleted, owing to the enor- 

 jnous number of men called to the colours, and the women who are 



