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tion of business and pleasure. Until the railway came in there, it 

 was more or less common. It was navigable and it is navigable 

 to-day. But the evidence seems pretty clear that there was very 

 little traffic on it; perhaps none except the motor boats and launches. 

 There were the docks. One of the witnesses said, "There is a wharf 

 at my place; there is another at Dodge shoal, and there is another 

 a little higher up." He also said, "Freight used to come down, but 

 the railways changed all that." 



Mr. Magrath: Do you think it would be necessary to go both 

 ways to cause it to be navigable? 



Mr. Guthrie: We can go both ways. 



We have in the South Sault an alternate route. I do not say it 

 is the best route. Let us have an ice jam in the North Sault; let us 

 have a gate on one of our locks thrown out of commission; we have 

 the alternative channel, and we do not want it blocked. But there 

 is a larger view of it even than that and the larger view is this : Some 

 day — and I trust soon — there will be a power development and a dam 

 across the North Sault. It has to be an international work, I assume. 

 Then it becomes all the more important to have the South Sault as 

 a navigable channel. 



Mr. Powell: That is an argument addressed to our discretion. 



Mr. Guthrie: Yes; I am only pointing out the importance of 

 it in this. I am not yielding a point in regard to our rights under the 

 treaty. Now, my information is that the Government has in con- 

 templation the construction of a dam across that North Branch. 

 It will have to be undertaken internationally. I assume, with the 

 concurrence of the United States. Probably it may be referred to 

 your Commission for settlement. But, if such a work is undertaken, 

 and the North channel is closed, the South channel becomes all the 

 more important. You may say that the Richelieu and Ontario boats 

 are too large to come down it now, but all that is required there is a 

 lock to make navigation good. My point, however, is that the water 

 is navigable, and that is so abundantly proved that I do not think I 

 need labour the question. 



Mr. Powell: There is one thing that bothers me, and I think 

 the case is stronger in your favour than you are putting it, because 

 the two High Contracting Parties in their language in the Ashburton 

 Treaty have recognized this very division of the water as navigable 

 and provided for it. 



Mr. Guthrie: I would not expect for a moment that I could 

 put it in language as strong as the treaty. I am relying on the treaty 

 but I am trying to point out some of the reasons for the great import- 

 ance of this question to the Government of Canada. The thing that 

 is also important and should not be lost sight of is this: That this 

 very concern, this Aluminum Company of America, with one of its 

 subsidiary companies, known as the Long Sault Development Com- 

 pany, attempted the very thing that the Government wants to do. 

 They tried to get the right to build a dam across there and they did 

 get the right from the State of New York, but, subseciuently, that 

 right was taken away by the State of New York and the matter got 

 to the courts and to the Supreme Court of the United States. 



