PERTAINING TO NEGOTIATION OF TREATY OF 1183. 225 



without an article in the treaty of peace acknowledging our right 



to the fishery ; that I was happy Mr. Laurens was now present, who, 



I believed, was in Congress at the time and must remember it. Mr. 



Laurens upon this said, with great firmness, that he was in the same 



case and could never give his voice for any articles without this. 



Mr. Jay spoke up, and said it could not be a peace; it would only 



be an insidious truce without it. 



******* 



November 30, 1782. 



We met first at Mr. Jay's, then at Mr. Oswald's; examined and 

 compared the treaties. * * * 



From first to last I ever insisted upon it with the English gentle- 

 men that the fisheries and the Mississippi, if America was not satis- 

 fied in those points, would be the sure and certain sources of a future 

 war. showed them the indispensable necessity of both to our affairs, 

 and that no treaty we could make which should be unsatisfactory 

 to our people on those points could be observed ; that the population 

 near the Mississippi would be so rapid, and the necessities of the 

 people for its navigation so pressing, that nothing could restrain 

 them from going down, and if the force of arms should be necessary, 

 it would not be wanting; that the fishery entered into our distilleries, 

 our coasting trade, our trade with the southern Stales, with the 

 West India islands, with the coast of Africa, and with every part 

 of Europe in such a manner, and especially with England, that it 

 could not be taken from us, or granted us stingily, without tearing 

 and rending; that the other states had staples, we had none but fish, 

 no other means of remittances to London, or paying those very debts 

 they had insisted upon so seriously; that if we were forced off, at 

 three leagues distance, we should smuggle eternally, that their men- 

 of-war might have the glory of sinking now and then a fishing 

 schooner, but this would not prevent a repetition of the crime, it 

 would only inflame, and irritate, and enkindle a new war, that in 

 en years we should break through all restraints and conquer from 

 ili- in the I -land of Newfoundland itself, and Nova Scotia too. 



Mr. Fitzherberf always smiled, and said it was very extraordinary 

 that the British ministry and we should see it in so different a Light. 

 That they meant the restriction in order to prevent disputes, and kill 

 the seeds of war, and we should think it so certain a source of dis- 

 putes, and SO 3trong ;i seed of war; but (hat our reasons were such 



thai he thought the probability <>n our side. 



I have not time to minute the conversation about the sea-cow fishery, 

 the whale fishery, the Magdalen [sland, the, Labrador coasts, and the 

 coasts of Nova Scotia. It is sufficient to say, they were explained to 



the utmost of our knowledge mid finally conceded. 



I mould have noted before the various deliberations between tho 

 English gentlemen and us. relative to the words "indefinite and 

 exclusive right, which the Count de Vergennes and M. Gerard had 

 the precaution to insert in our treaty with France. I observed often 

 to the English g< ntlemen, that, aiming .it excluding us from fishing 

 upon the north dde "f Newfoundland, it was natural for them t<> 

 wish that the English would exclude us from the south side. This 

 would be making both alike, and take away an odious distinction. 



