926 NORTH ATLANTIC COAST FISHERIES ARBITRATION. 



JUDGE GRAY: Oh, yes. 



SIR JAMES WINTER harbours and creeks of Newfoundland to fish. 



JUDGE GRAY : Oh, yes. 



SIR JAMES WINTER : And this herring business is carried on in the 

 bays, harbours and creeks into which the Americans claim the right, 

 under the treaty, to enter, and Great Britain denies that right. 



JUDGE GRAY: There is no fishery of that kind except within the 

 3-mile limit? There is no fishery of that kind except in the bays? 



SIR JAMES WINTER: No; the herring fishery is in the bays and 



harbours. 



553 JUDGE GRAY: Therefore, under your contention, that the 

 American fishermen are not allowed by the treaty of 1818, 

 by the wording of that treaty, to go into the bays, that liberty is 

 practically worthless? 



SIR JAMES WINTER : Which liberty ? 



JUDGE GRAY : The liberty to take fish in the prescribed waters. 



SIR JAMES WINTER : Precisely. It is worthless, but the construc- 

 tion of the view, or the stand or position which Great Britain takes 

 upon that matter is, that it was always worthless. 



THE PRESIDENT: That it would be worthless as regards herring? 



SIR JAMES WINTER: Yes; that it has always been worthless as 

 regards herring, and practically also worthless as regards the cod 

 fishery on that part of the coast. As a matter of fact it will be 

 found, and cannot be disputed I make the statement unreservedly, 

 without qualification, and I believe it will not be disputed; and if 

 it is disputed, of course, then. I cannot insist upon its being accepted 

 unless it is supported by evidence that the evidence clearly shows 

 (as I think I shall satisfy the Court upon another issue) that there 

 has been actually no cod fishery on that part of the coast carried on 

 even by the Americans. That part of the coast is particularly one, 

 or especially one where there is no cod fishery, and never has been, 

 of any value. There is a little cod fishery, but it is out in the deep 

 water, more than 3 miles from the shore, all along from Cape Ray 

 down to Quirpon. except in some small areas where the French have 

 got establishments, and have had establishments for many years, 

 down further north, towards the Straits of Belleisle, where there 

 is a considerable fishery; but even there, the greater part of the 

 fishery is more than 3 miles from the shore. Little or no cod-fish 

 are ever caught near to the shore on that part of the coast, or any- 

 where except Labrador. 



THE PRESIDENT : If you please, Sir James : What is the difference 

 between the two branches of section 1 of the Newfoundland statute 

 of 1892? In the first branch, it is said: "That no person shall 

 haul, catch, or take herrings by any seine or other such contrivance " 



