CANADIAN rnni-:sritY ASSOCIATION 37 



things that occur to one, but I will take up your time only to speak of two which im- 

 pressed me when he read his paper. Perhaps I am a little selfish m asking for his 

 views, because they are more matters of public policy and legislation, perhaps, than the 

 forest reserve work in general. One is his reference to timber berths which have been 

 sold, as I take it, by public competition to certain persons who are now the licensees, 

 and where the pine timber only was sold. I infer from his observations that he thinks 

 there might be, in certain limits of that description, which have passed from the Crown 

 in the way I have indicated, some policy introduced whereby the licensee could re- 

 forest that particular berth. A policy of that kind could only be worked out on non- 

 agricultural lands, as agricultural lands are required for settlement. Of course I 

 would like to know what his view is as to what payment the Crown should obtain to 

 allow a licensee to continue almost in perpetuity. Forest reserve areas belong to the 

 Crown. When the timber is sold by public sale the bonus derived is supposed to be the 

 value on the stump of the pine timber that is standing at that time. And then dues 

 are paid on timber when cut. Now, suppose the licensee is allowed the pine on that 

 area for the next 40 or 50 years, what position, in his opinion, should the Crown take 

 in order to get proper revenue from a licensee under that policy, because as adminis- 

 trators of the people's business it is our duty to see that the Crown gets all it is en- 

 titled to from the people's domain. 



We are endeavouring to see whether some legislation can be introduced to cover 

 the case of townships in Muskoka, such as mentioned by Mr. Bertram, where we have 

 had several petitions from councils of townships asking that land sold at tax sales 

 might be bought in by the township, and some of these areas set apart as forest reserves 

 by the municipalities. I would like to ask Mr. Bertram, who has large experience in 

 this matter, what he would suggest as to the management of these reserves. Should 

 they be absolutely under the control of the council of the municipality ? Would 

 they have sufficient experience to handle these to advantage ? Or should we have a 

 general policy directed through the Bureau of Forestry in this Province, having a 

 certain control over all such reserves, and giving suggestions as to how they should be 

 managed in the most up-to-date manner ? Then as to revenue to be derived from them. 

 What would he suggest as to the utilization of that revenue ? How much expenditure 

 should be placed upon the municipality ? Or whether it should be managed by our 

 Provincial Bureau, or entirely left with the municipality ? 



I am glad to be with you and am sure you will have a useful and prosperous after- 

 noon, and if I can manage to steal away from my departmental and legislative duties 

 to-morrow I will be glad to come in again and gain further information from you. 



Mr. BERTRAM. Mr. President, the Commissioner of Crown Lands has done me 

 the honour to ask me to advise the Government. Of course, advice is very often cheap, 

 and it may be very easily given, but I would like to say to the Hon. Mr. Davis that he 

 has put his finger on two of the most difficult questions he could ask one, and as I 

 am an exceedingly slow man, and never dare make up my mind in a hurry, I have to 

 think it over. These two very points have been in my mind a great many times. I 

 may say that, some 22 or 23 years ago, after retiring as I thought, from business, I 

 by a mere chance got into the lumber business, and I never was in any business before 



