28 



Mr. R. GIBSON (Hay) proposed that tlic matter for discussion should be the constitution of the 

 Stock Protection Board, and on what basis they should be elected. 



Mr. ALISON (Canonbar) on a point of order, contended that clause 12 must be finished first. 



The CHAIRMAN thought that if they went on with clause 12 they would have to go tack over the 

 old ground. 



Mr. S. Nrxox (Gunbar) seconded the motion. 



The question on being put was negatived. 



Mr. ALISON (Canonbar) said they had to deal with the cultivated lands. As he pointed out 

 yesterday, in clause 12, subsection (), it said, "cultivated lands shall be taken to be capable of carrying as 

 many sheep as they would carry if laid down in grass." He disagreed with the proposition in the Bill. 

 He thought that cultivated lands, instead of being taxed as laid down in grass, should be taxed as if in their 

 normal condition. He thought it would be found impossible to state the value of any cultivated land in 

 its original state. They could not judge from the surrounding country. It might not be of the same 

 nature. It would be best for them to arrive at some conclusion as to how many sheep an acre of culti- 

 vated land should be assessed at. He would like to see it agreed that all cultivated land should be put 

 on a basis of 1, 2,3, 4, or 5 sheep. He pointed out to the farmers that if they had an expert going round, 

 the expert would go to the Board and give his opinion, and the farmer would then have to go to the Board 

 and give his opinion, and would have to bring witnesses, and there might be an appeal to another Board, 

 and bv this means he would be put to great expense. If they could arrive at a rough and ready nay of 

 assessing him it would be much cheaper to the Board, and much cheaper to the farmer, and he would know 

 exactly what he had to pay. The whole of the money would go to the Board without any subtraction for 

 the expense of the expert who would go and value that land. He thought if they had to value the land 

 the expense they would have to go to would be more than the amount contributed. Let it be put at a 

 small lenient rate, so that no farmer should be put upon. He would sooner see a man get off than that 

 he should pay too much. He moved that any cultivated lands should be assessed on the basis of 5 acres 

 to one sheep. 



Mr. .1. H. VABCOE (Hillston) asked how would his cultivated lands be assessed at a sheep to the 

 acre. He was already assessed at the stock that the land he had cultivated was carrying. 



Mr. COOK (Beringerry) moved as an amendment, " That it would be 1 acre to two sheep." He was 

 both a wheat-grower and a sheep-owner, and knew something about the matter. They wanted a reason- 

 able thing, and did not want to get off too easily. A sheep to 2 acres was a fair thing. 



Mr. GIBSON (Hay) seconded the amendment pro forma, although he was opposed both to the 

 motion and to the amendment. The Minister had pointed out the folly of laying down a hard and fast 

 rule. In his district it took 3 acres of good grazing land to carry a sheep ; in the Berrigan district 



1 or 2 acres will carry a sheep ; in other districts two sheep might be carried to an acre. Why should we 

 lay down a hard-and-fast rule that will give a concession to one class of owners in one district, and will not 

 give a concession to another class of holders in another district. Some gentlemen kept harping on these 

 experts. He did not know what part of the Colony they came from. He came from a part of the 

 country where there were a large number of these experts. He thought it could safely be left to the 

 Board. They were going to elect their own members, and they could safely leave it in their hands and to 

 their practical knowledge, and there should be no necessity to bring men down from any other part of 

 the Colony to give evidence. 



Mr. J. 11. BRETT (Urana) seconded Mr. Alison's motion. 



Mr. ELANAIIAN supported the motion. They had passed a clause that Crown lands should be rated 

 at 10 acres to the sheep. He thought Mr. Alison's motion of 5 acres to the sheep would be more in 

 accordance with the motion carried yesterday. Regarding a few words that had dropped from Mr. Cook, 

 who said something to the effect that there were no cultivated lands that would not carry one sheep to 



2 acres, he had himself brought into cultivation certain land of which 15 acres would not support 

 one sheep. The Boards would have to raise the rate from ^d. to 3d. per sheep to deal with the rabbit 

 pest if it were on that basis. They must all know of scrub lands that would not feed sheep, and that they 

 were the most difficult lauds in the Colony to eradicate rabbits from. These rabbits could live where 

 there is timber and scrub that will not feed sheep, and will live there without any water. Babbits could 

 be eradicated much easier from the rich country than they could from the bad country. The day would 

 come when every man in the community will have a voice in the election of M'embers of Parliament for 

 their districts, and iE they did not adequately take into consideration the interests of the small men all 

 their work would be cast aside by their representatives in Parliament, for there they would not be repre- 

 sented on the basis of the stock they owned. 



Mr. NIXON (Gunbar) thought it inexpedient to make any hard-and-fast rule. There were districts 

 that would carry considerably over a sheep to the acre. He thought it should be left entirely to the 

 Boards to decide without any expert evidence. He was quite sure it would give more satisfaction. 



Mr. T. BROWN, M.L.A. (Budgerabong), proposed, as a further amendment, ' That cultivated land 

 not assessed under a Stock and Pastures Protection Act be assessed by the Board on the basis of the 

 carrying capacity of the adjacent grazing grounds." He believed that the wish of the Conference was to 

 assess on the stock-carrying capacity and not on their cultivation basis, and the best way to arrive at that 

 was to determine it by the adjacent grazing lands, and to leave the assessment in the hands of the Local 

 Stock Board. 



Mr. LITTLE (Bullock Creek) seconded the amendment. 



Mr. WILKKS (Broken Hill) considered that Mr. Gibson and Mr. Brown were only on a bogey. 

 Thty would allow that a man who had a thousand acres of cultivated land must have ten horses to work 

 it. On Mr. Alison's 5 acres to a sheep, his rate would be lOOd. an assessment of a matter of 8s. 4d. ; 

 and would it not be better to do that great wrong rather than bring together this Board, the witnesses, 

 and the Land Agent, on whom they would have to spend a good many eight-and-fourpences. This must be 

 drawn on the lines that Mr. Alison laid down. He did not say, " Stick to 5 or 10 acres," but it must be 

 on those lines. 



Mr. A. L. B. CAMERON (Ivanhoe) while looking upon Mr. Alison's proposal as the best and most 

 rough and ready method of dealing with this question, pointed out that it was a clause that was likely to 

 meet with a considerable amount of opposition in Parliament. The Minister had already said that he was 

 opposed to these hard-and-fast rules. He thought it would be best not to pass resolutions which were 

 likely to meet with opposition in Parliament. He thought Mr. Brown's amendment the same as Mr. 

 Gibson's. Mr. 



