May 30, 1907 



American Hee Journal 



it there, what would it be? Would it 

 be good honey? 



Mr. IMoore — Bad honey is honey, just 

 the same. 



Mr. Taylor — No; it is nectar. 

 _ Dr. Miller— Mr. President, wouldn't 

 It be of advantage to talk about some- 

 thing we know something about? 

 Pres. York — Sure! 



Mr. Kimmey — If we are going to talk 

 about something we know all about, 

 there is no use of talking. We might 

 as well go home. 



Pres. York— I think a convention of 

 bee-keepers ought to know something 

 about honey. 



Mr. Kimmey— -Perhaps you will re- 

 member a few years ago we were talk- 

 mg about the same question, and I asked 

 Dr. Eaton, the Illinois State chemist, 

 if it were possible for a chemist to pro- 

 duce a single drop of honev, and he 

 said no. We may talk about 'bees gath- 

 ering nectar from the flowers; it is 

 not honey. I once at a table said to 

 a lady, "Why do you put cream in your 

 coffee? Why not put in butter? It 

 IS the same thing." "Yes," she said. 

 Why not put grass in your coffee? It 

 IS the same thing." It isn't the same. 

 You can't make a drop of honey unless 

 you let the bee go out and gather the 

 nectar and put it in its organism. I 

 have tried to find out e.xactly what they 

 do. You honey-dealers just keep quiet 

 a httle and try to look wise. I have 

 seen some of your product and, unbe- 

 known to you, I have had some of it 

 analyzed. You do not get honey until 

 the bees work it over. I think you can 

 say they make honey just as surely as 

 the cow makes milk, and in that sense 

 I think it is an animal product, from the 

 matter of working over a vegetable pro- 

 duct, just as lard is an animal product; 

 perhaps not e.x-actly work on it, but there 

 is a change made which makes it animal 

 instead of vegetable. It is not simply 

 gathering nectar. 



On motion, an adjournment was taken 

 until I -.30 p. m. 



FIRST DAY— Second Session. 



The convention met at i :3o p. m. 



Pres. York— Is there anything to come 

 before the convention before we take up 

 the questions? Under the heading of 

 Miscellaneous Business there is the 

 question of joining the National Bee- 

 Keepers' Association in a body. What 

 shall we do about it? 



Joining the National in a Body. 



Mr. Wilco.x— I move that we join the 

 National in a body. 



The motion was seconded. 



Pres York— Are there any remarks on 

 the motion? 



Mr. Moore— Not to obtrude my own 

 vievys on this assembly, but to get the 

 subject before you, I want to object to 

 joining the National in a body. My 

 objections are nothing new. Our in- 

 come is rather small. The Treasurer's 

 report shows about $22 in the treasury 

 before this meeting, and when we join 

 the National and pay them 50 cents, and 

 join the Illinois State State Association 

 and pay them 25 cents, that leaves us 

 25 cents for our income, which is hardiv 

 sufficient to pay our expenses; and i'f 

 this Association wants to continue join- 



ing both these associations in a body, 

 I want them to do it with their eyes 

 open to the facts in the matter. Do what 

 seems best. 



Dr.Miller — Across the ocean they are a 

 long way ahead of ours. Only this past 

 week I noticed the Austrians were con- 

 gratulating themselves that they had 

 reached the number of 10,000. Then 

 here is the united organization of pretty 

 much all of those that use the German 

 language, in which I think there are 

 perhaps 30,000. They do it largely by 

 the fact that the smaller societies unite, 

 and if we consider it important to have 

 the National Association what it ought 

 to be — if it grows to what it ought to 

 be— I believe it will be more than any- 

 thing else by associations like this join- 

 ing in a body. If we do not do it, the 

 National is going to remain always a 

 great deal smaller than it will if we do ; 

 and so for the sake of having the Na- 

 tional encouraged and increased as it 

 ought to be, I should even vote to in- 

 crease the amount of money we pay into 

 the treasury here rather than to with- 

 draw from uniting with the National in 

 a body — if that is the only question — the 

 question of money — and it is necessary 

 to have a larger amount of money. I 

 consider it of very, very great impor- 

 tance, that we do that very thing — unite 

 in a body. 



The motion was put and carried. 



On motion, it was voted not to join 

 the Illinois State Bee-Keepers' Associa- 

 tion in a body, a very influential reason 

 being that if we join one State associa- 

 tion we ought to join several, as differ- 

 ent States are represented in the mem- 

 bership of the Chicago-Northwestern. 



How TO Construct Langstroth Hives. 



"How should the Langstroth hive be 

 constructed for general convenience and 

 durability among American bee-keep- 

 ers?" 



Mr. Taylor — A plain box, without any 

 cleats. 



Dr. Bohrer — I wrote that question. I 

 began the use of the Langstroth bee-hive 

 more than 40 years ago. I think in 1864 

 I used it first, and Mr. Langstroth him- 

 self used it at that time. I have seen 

 a good many changes, some very valu- 

 able improvements, and some so-called 

 improvements that in my opinion are 

 not valuable improvements at all; at 

 least, they would not work well with 

 me, and in bringing up this question I 

 have no war to make with the gentlemen 

 who manufacture bee-hives. I believe 

 it to be the duty of bee-keepers, not only 

 as individuals but as an organization, to 

 make known to the manufacturers what 

 their actual wants are, and ask them to 

 make their hives in accordance therewith ; 

 and I believe they will do it. As long 

 as we stand off and they go to work 

 and make a hive of this idea and that and 

 the other, you will have a whole lot of 

 different patterns, and no one will suit 

 but a few bee-keepers. I have never 

 seen a hive that pleased me any better, 

 that is, the construction of the frame, 

 than Mr. Langstroth's frame as he used 

 it 40 odd years ago. The bees in Kansas 

 would not glue the frames together, as 

 they do with what is known as the Hoff- 

 man frame. There are two valuable fea- 

 tures about the Hoffman frame— the 



heavy top-bar and grooves. The frames 

 as constructed by Mr. Langstroth I liked 

 as well as anything at that day and time, 

 but the grooved frame and heavy top- 

 bar were certainly improvements. The 

 Hoffman frame did not suit me at all. 

 I killed too many bees, even if there 

 wasn't too much propolis carried in. 

 I object to that, and I object to the so- 

 called improvement of the bottom-board 

 being made out of lumber hardly % 

 inch thick, so that it will shrink and the 

 bees crawl out of the bottom. It is too 

 thin to ship bees in, and not safe to 

 handle bees in to move them from one 

 apiary to another, or even about the 

 farm. I say to manufacturers. Don't 

 make them that way. You are not bene- 

 fiting us as you might do with another 

 follower or division-board. I want it 

 made out of something not less than ^ 

 inch thick. I would not undertake to 

 ship a colony of bees with that kind of 

 a bottom-board. I have to go to work 

 and make new bottom-boards for those 

 hives. They are absolutely next to 

 worthless. I want to repeat that I am 

 not making war upon any manufacturer, 

 but when you manufacture a hive of that 

 kind you are not manufacturing what the 

 bee-keeper really wants — what he stands 

 in need of. 



And now on the production of comb 

 honey. I am not handling bees much 

 for comb honey. Men who do would 

 know more how to dispose of that fea- 

 ture of the subject than I do. My idea 

 is and has been for years, that I can 

 produce more honey and cheaper and 

 can sell it for less money, and in the 

 long run make more money, than the 

 man can who produces comb honey 

 alone, that is, by the use of an extract- 

 or. 



Mr. Sewell — The hive I use myself I 

 can make for about 25 cents. I mean 

 I can get it cut out at the mill for about 

 that price, and it is a good hive. But 

 perhaps it could be improved quite a 

 little. While I had a Langstroth hive 

 when I was about 10 years old, yet I 

 have not had very many hives since, for 

 the last few years not over S, and it 

 seems to me I could learn a great deal 

 about hives. The hive that we have is 

 a dovetailed; that is a little more ex- 

 pensive than necessary, it seems to me, 

 but I don't know. Perhaps 20 years is 

 long enough without paintings but if 

 they last 20 years without painting, they 

 ought to last considerably longer if they 

 are painted ; but it is a question that I 

 think all of us are very much interested 

 in. Personally, I like the halved cor- 

 ner better than the dovetailed corner. 



A Member — Can you get that for 25 

 cents? 



Mr. Sewell — I mean just the brood- 

 chamber. The hive I use is a very plain 

 hive. I don't know that I need to des- 

 cribe it, but I would like to hear more 

 said about this matter. A great many 

 of us want more hives. We want them 

 as cheap as we can get them. We want 

 them as plain and as easily operated 

 as possible, and we want them to last 

 just as long as possible. 



Mr. Taylor — I have had considerable 

 experience in using hives and in making 

 them. Some here have had more ex- 

 perience than I have, but I should say 

 that if a person wishes to use a Lang- 

 stroth hive, to make it just as plain as he 



