43 



Mr. Rogers. Yes. That is present law, I think. 



Mr. Fraser. In accordance with the 



Mr. Rogers. Geneva Convention. 



Mr. Fraser. In accordance with the Geneva Convention? 



Mr. Rogers. Certainly. 



Mr. Fraser. Which would mean that landlocked nations had no 

 rights at all to the exploitation of the sea? 



Mr. Rogers. That is right. This is exactly what I believe. 



For instance, I do not know how many claim ownership of the moon. 



Mr. Fraser. I think M-e have made some disposition of that noAv 

 through an international agreement. 



You are suggesting we should substitute. I think this has been the 

 subject of discussion. 



Mr. Rogers. To give every nation a portion? 



Mr. Fraser. My understanding is this— and I would be quite wilhng 

 to be corrected— we have in eifect said that no nation may make a 

 territorial claim to the moon. 



Mr. Rogers. No claims of sovereignty. 



Mr. Fraser. Yes, of the kind that sovereignty impUes, which is that 

 you have certain rights to the exclusion of others. So we have done 

 what you have suggested; that is, we have dealt with the subject; 

 maybe not the way that you would have preferred we divide it up. 



Mr. Rogers. I think not, really. When you say no nation can make 

 a claim of sovereignty, are you saying that it is thereby transferred 

 to the United Nations? 



Mr. Fraser. What I understand is that it does, basically, define 

 national rights with respect to the moon, which is to say that no nation 

 may assert any rights to the exclusion of other nations and that no one 

 may acquire sovereignty over any portion of it. Now, this is a layman's 

 understanding of it. 



Mr. Rogers. Would this apply to Red China, which is not a mem- 

 ber? She is now developing nuclear power. Maybe they are going to 

 have a rocket soon. 



Mr. Fraser. I assume that Red China would have to make its own 

 decision as to whether it was bound. 



Mr. Rogers. True. That is what we are sa5dng: That every nation 

 ought to make its own decision and let's not have the United Nations 

 do it. 



Mr. Fountain. Would you yield? 



Mr. Fraser. Yes. 



Mr. Fountain. Mr. Rogers, I do not understand you to mean 

 that, notwithstanding these rights which have been established, just 

 as we have relations in our Federal system between local. State and 

 Federal governments, that you would not agree that this is an area 

 where there should be international cooperation and discussion and 

 exploration? 



Mr. Rogers. Yes. 



Mr. Fountain. In the hiterest of all nations of the world, not 

 just ours? 



Mr. Rogers. Yes, because I think existing international luw has 

 that effect. I am talking about the sovereignty to sea bottom and the 

 minerals therein or tliereon. 



Mr. Fraser. Thank you. 



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