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to you about it in private, and not take the time right at this moment. 



Dr. Chapman. 



Dr. W. M. Chapman. At the risk of boring you, I am going to talk 

 about coastal zone laboratories anyway. 



I have been sitting, having a little difficulty thinking about coastal 

 zone laboratories and coastal zone management authorities in the light 

 of our experience in California, and these thoughts maybe have no 

 value to the rest of you, but they have been turning over in my mind 

 this morning. 



It seems to me like we have got an adequate number of laboratories 

 in California, and really along the west coast, that our problem is not 

 number or diversity of laboratories, or activities, but in almost every 

 instance I can think of, a deficiency of funds for those laboratories to 

 adequately carry out their research programs. 



The coastal zone laboratory term does not very w^ell fit our situation, 

 iDecause we have such institutions as Hopkins Marine Station, for 

 instance, and the USC laboratories, and the Scripps laboratories that 

 are coastal zone laboratories already, but also work in other parts of 

 the world ocean. 



In fact, a new designation just does not seem to me to be terribly 

 utilitarian, or attractive. TVTiat we really need is new money. 



If you call these this as a name in order to con the Bureau of the 

 Budget out of some more money, and it works, fine. ISIy experience 

 is that it will not work. 



I think that there is a difference in our thinking on the west coast 

 irom that on the east coast and gulf, because of our situation on the 

 'western side of the country, and having both our ocean and atmos- 

 pheric weather come at us from far over the horizon, and affect mate- 

 rially the natural processes in our immediate coastal zone without our 

 being able to evaluate or study or predict those effects unless we look 

 far over the sea. 



That puts us perhaps a little more, when we are talking about coastal 

 processes, in a process of quite large dimension, and in some instances 

 of global dimension. 



I think that is a difference in thinking that will always plague us 

 in talking with our colleagues in the gulf and the Atlantic coast. 



I don't think the differences should be a controversial one at all. 

 It is due to natural circumstances. "We are more broadly interested in 

 something from the coastal zone standpoint. 



Comment came up this morning with respect to the dichotomy of 

 either doing more research or getting things done, which is, I think, 

 an extremely false one, and should not enter into our discussion at all. 



I speak ordinarily as an industry representative who wants the bene- 

 ficial output in research. I want to get things done, but as you know, 

 Mr. Chairman, I spend almost all my time fomenting additional — 

 what Stu does not like to call, or I don't like to call — basic research, 

 because we are so enormously eager about the ocean and atmosphere 

 that we are unable to make value judgments in many important 

 instances. 



You have to have a proper balance between implementation and 

 the conduct or the research and processes. 



I want to go on with one little comment that arose this morning, 

 about how the relationship works between the Corps of Engineers and 



