OCEANOGRAPHY 1961 — PHASE 3 227 



Now, question : That is a pretty strong statement. I happen to- 

 agree with you on it. But is it 3'^our opinion that we are in a welter 

 01 confusion in this oceanograpliic program of ours ? 



Professor Lewis. The reading I have done on the su])ject has led 

 me to that conclusion, Mr. Dingell. 



Mr. Dingell. All right. Now, let us go a step further. Is it 

 your conclusion that the ad hoc agency set up by Executive order is 

 going to clear up this problem ? 



Professor Lewis. I would say that the ad hoc agency set up ad- 

 ministratively has been functioning for some time, and there has been 

 little apparent improvement in the program organization during that 

 interval of time. 



Mr. Dingell. Now, one last question. I would like to have you 

 give the committee, this morning, your background, not only in the- 

 field of education but also in the field of governmental activity. 



Mr. Miller. I think I read some of that into the record at the 

 beginning. 



Mr. Dingell. Then I would be happy to let it stand at that. 



Thank you very much. 



Mr. Millek. Mr. Lennon? 



Mr. Lennon. Mr. Chairman, since I have been a member of this 

 committee, since early last year, I have waited patiently for just the 

 statement that Professor Lewis has brought out today. We have 

 wallowed in a morass of testimony from the various agencies of the 

 Federal Government as to what it was doing and intended to do in 

 this field of oceanography, and all the while I sat and listened I have- 

 been wondering when someone at the management level would come 

 here and suggest how we could put this program together. 



The gentleman to my left was very charitable in his remarks, in 

 which he stated he agreed with you, in substance, with respect to your 

 statement as found on page 12. 



I think the guts of your statement are found on page 6, beginning at 

 line 6 and ending at line 14. I do not see how anyone who attended 

 a majority of these hearings could fail to agree with you. 



The Chairman of the Interagency Committee on Oceanography^ 

 the Assistant Secretary of the Navy, testified day before yesterday, 

 and he indicated that even this legislation was not necessary, in his 

 judgment. The representative of the Bureau of the Budget on the 

 same day testified that in his opinion the legislation was not necessary ; 

 that we were making all the progress that seemed to be necessary in 

 this important field. 



I think we have got to decide once and for all : Is this an unportant 

 program, sufficiently so to establish a separate and independent agency 

 for the administration of it ? 



I am led to believe that it is. Perhaps others may not be. 



You say this is the minimum. You have made three suggestions. 

 You say this is the moderate course, the minimum that we can do. 

 And you say even the provisions of this bill, in your judgment, will 

 not meet what you see for the future in this program, unless it is 

 amended along the lines that you have suggested in your statement. 

 And I agree with that. 



I am inclined to go the full way, myself, but I can perhaps see, as 

 you have pointed out so clearly, the disadvantages certainly for the 



