OCEANOGRAPHY 1961 — PHASE 3 319 



under what would be termed in essence a "voluntary interagency 

 committee." 



Would you care to comment on that or would you rather someone 

 else would do it? 



Mr. Paul. I am rather certain that was probably Dr. Wakelin from 

 the Navy, the Chairman of the Interagency Oceanography Committee, 

 who testified. He was expressing the administration's view. I think 

 their feeling has been the present degree of coordination has been 

 relatively good and that the total oceanographic program needs to be 

 strengthened. 



As a strictly personal viewpoint, as I testified the last couple of 

 years before your committee, I feel quite strongly that an expres- 

 sion of intent and an expression of interest by the Congress in tliis 

 whole field would be very helpful. 



Mr. Lennon. I want to say to you there is no intent on the part of 

 this committee or of the Congress to invade any executive responsi- 

 bility in this field. It seems to me that the coordination of the two 

 through an expression of Congress in putting its stamp of approval 

 legislativewise on a program which has been recommended at the 

 executive level certainly could do nothing in the world but strengthen 

 the program, as I see it. 



The difficulty, if you have a voluntary interagency committee, is 

 that of the Congress or the legislative committee of Congress in calling 

 in a witness from one of the several agencies represented and getting 

 a short, quick statement from him. If you had a person who could 

 speak authoritatively for this National Oceanography Council, he 

 could come here and in 2 hours' time cover the field, so to speak, as to 

 the progress being made by the various departments that were allied 

 with this national council. You know what happens if you bring 

 before us here a person representing the Navy. He is going to take an 

 hour and a half, if necessary, to point out what they are doing. 



It looks like if this bill passes, there would be at least 8 and per- 

 haps 10 of our departments or agencies on tliis Council, all at top 

 level, even at secretarial level. That is one reason I think it is impera- 

 tive that we have some central agency representative or spokesman 

 who can speak authoritatively so we can determine what progress the 

 program is making rather than have to call in every one of the agencies 

 involved in this so-called voluntary interagency committee. 



I think the point is well taken, it is true the administration has 

 indicated they thought this was sufficient, but I do not believe there 

 is any serious opposition on the part of anyone connected with the 

 administration in what we are trying to do, to give congressional 

 legislative approval to what the administration has recommended. 

 That is what we are doing. 



We are not running counter to their purposes but are going down 

 the line with them, trying to strengthen their position. At the present 

 time if we authorize the appropriation, which is subsequently appro- 

 priated, then we have a right to look to some central agency to tell 

 us what progress is being made because we have to answer to the tax- 

 payers and you folks do not. That is the difference. They are right 

 important people these days, you know. Thank you. 



Mr. DiNGELL. Mr. Paul, I notice you said you had Mr. Swartz here, 

 who is in charge of the program of salt water sport fisheries research 

 in your Department. 



