348 OCEANOGRAPHY 1961 — PHASE 3 



to educational and private institutions engaged in oceanography, 

 section 8 would have no practical effect, would it ? 



Mr. EuTTENBERG. Technically, it does not appear to have any effect, 

 that is correct. 



Mr. Lennon. To what extent is private industry participating in 

 the activities of these institutions such as Scripps and Woods Hole and 

 colleges and universities? Do they make any contribution to opera- 

 tion and maintenance funds, or is that all done by Government 

 contract ? 



Dr. Robertson. I believe that Woods Hole and the other nonprofit 

 private institutions receive some help from industry in the form of 

 money and equipment. I do not know the extent of that help. 



Mr. Lennon. The testimony reflects that so far as Woods Hole is 

 concerned, 90 percent of their operating funds come from Government 

 contracts, so we find ourselves in a position of the Federal Government 

 putting up the money for your capital assets to an appreciable degree 

 so far as ship construction is concerned, and then the taxpayers also 

 pick up 90 percent of the tab for operation and maintenance of 

 those private institutions. Is that not what the record reflects ? 



Dr. Robertson. I think it might be commented 



Mr. Lennon. Just answer the question and then explain it, please. 

 Is that not what the record reflects ? 



Dr. Bolt. Yes, of course. 



Mr. Lennon. Now make any explanation you wish. 



Dr. Robertson. I was simply going to comment that if we did not 

 have Woods Hole, a major institution of oceanography on the east 

 coast, it is very likely that the Government would have set up a na- 

 tional center for oceanography research. I think it is fortunate that 

 we have a private group that is able to do this work. 



Mr. Lennon. I am not singling that out. I am just trying to get in 

 the record, generally speaking, the taxpayers, indirectly through con- 

 tract, furnish approximately 90 percent of the operating expenses of 

 these private institutions which engage in something that we are also 

 interested in, oceanography, and in addition, the Federal Government 

 puts up the largest amount of the funds that are capital assets in the 

 construction of these ships which are going to be needed. 



I am just seeking information. 



Dr. Bolt. Mr. Lennon, that is right, but the fraction of support by 

 the Federal Government varies considerably among the different fields 

 of science. If you will look at all types of basic research being done in 

 universities today, the Federal Government is putting in about 60 per- 

 cent of this, and in some fields industry is contributing quite sizably. 



Also, in many institutions, the State legislatures are contributing to 

 the support of basic research. It just happens that oceanography is 

 one which is very largely supported by Federal funds. 



Mr. Lennon. Private institutions can still do it and a whole lot 

 cheaper than perhaps the Federal Government could, if it was in the 

 whole way. 



Mr. Miller. I was going to say any contributions made to Woods 

 Hole or most any of these institutions are contributions made by people 

 who are interested in the advancement of science, not that they hope 

 to obtain any immediate reward from it. 



We know that in the steel industry, and the textile industry, and 

 many of these others, contributions are made to universities and to 



