NATIONAL OCEAN'OGRAPHIC PROGRAM LEGISLATION 367 



many years, and the division in Philadelphia has provided propulsion 

 gear for subsurface vehicles for many years. 



So I represent only one pait of the total Westinghouse effort where 

 underseas is concerned. The division I head does have the responsi- 

 bility for providing the leadership in the corporation for the future 

 efforts in underseas work. 



Mr. Reinegke. Your listing of the various activities there indicated 

 that almost all of your effort is with respect to military or Government 

 work. Is that right ? 



Mr. Clotvvortpiy. A major percentage of it is. 



Mr. Reinecke. Is there any appreciable program having to do with 

 private investigation for private industry ? 



Mr. Clotworthy. Yes. There is obviously a great area between 

 pure military and pure industrial. We have a program with the Coast 

 and Geodetic Survey. We have had several programs with universi- 

 ties, particularly the University of California. Our most significant 

 program with an industrial element in it is the current effort to de\dse 

 new methods for catching fish by applying the fruits of some modern 

 technology to the age-old problem of liow^ to locate and catch fish. 



In addition, we have had an extensive cooperative program, how to 

 build small man submersibles, both for research as well as for 

 exploitation. 



Mr. Reinecke. The reason I asked that is, frankly, your statement 

 is you feel that further development of the ocean technology will be 

 stifled miless — what I feel you saying is, unless the Government 

 spends more money, it is too big for private investment and to have 

 private direction. 



Further, you say, when industry is unwilling or incapable, it should 

 be prepared to perform limited applications. 



Do you really feel this is so much a Federal role that we should put 

 industrial participation at a second-class level ? 



Mr. Clotworthy. No. Let me clarify that. 



In my prepared statement I have tried to draw a clear distinction 

 between the science and the technology. The technology is the applier 

 of science. 



I feel that the private sector of our economy is amply motivated to 

 exploit the ocean, to apply the science, to develop the technology, and 

 that the natural forces at work in the economy are quite satisfactory 

 and will provide impetus where impetus is needed. 



The thing that I am advocatmg is a much stronger support and a 

 well-directed support of the basic science, the gathering of basic sci- 

 entific data about the ocean, upon which a technology can be founded. 



I am saying, in effect, that technology has moved ahead quite rapidly 

 on the basis of unsettled scientific ground, and what I feel is necessary 

 in order to prevent a stifling of this already considerable movement in 

 the private sector of the economy is now a bolstering of our effort in 

 the pure science. 



Mr. Reinecke. Do you not feel that private industry will, when 

 necessary, make its own investigations into the realm of pure science 

 that would either encourage or help this particular technology? 



Mr. Clotworthy. There is no "Yes" or "No" answer to that ques- 

 tion. We are currently involved every day in the fringes of pure 

 scientific investigation. One must be, because the application of the 



