NATIONAL OCEANOGRAPHIC PROGRAM LEGISLATION 485 



Mr. Rogers. He is saying because of the added expense and tlie 

 cost, we are not getting as much for the money that we have been 

 spending. 



Mr. Seidman. I know we are spending less on capital construction. 

 A good part of our expenditures for oceanography were going into 

 the construction of ships. This is one of the difficulties — ^oceanog- 

 raphy is expensive, it takes time to get the ships to be used to con- 

 duct surveys and for research and to obtain the people and train 

 them. Maybe Dr. Berg can respond to this. 



Mr. Rogers. Yes. 



Mr. Berg. I think Dr. Hollomon has put his finger on a real 

 problem here; as you get more ships and gather more data, you 

 have a greater problem of analysis with respect to those studies. 



These moneys do compete — the research moneys do compete witli 

 the ship operating costs, which, of course, are high. It is a prob- 

 lem. 



Mr. Rogers. I think this has been helpful for us to see that you 

 are willing to have an open mind on getting this commission going 

 and getting something going, and I cannot stress, I think, too strong- 

 ly to you the concern of the Members of Congress that we are not 

 really moving in the field of oceanography as we should. There is 

 great -concern of this. This is what, our third week of hearings, 

 Mr. Chairman? 



Mr. Lennon. Yes. 



Mr. Rogers. The third week of hearings now and the interest has 

 been extremely high, and the Congress wants something done and 

 I am glad to see that the Bureau of the Budget is coming in with 

 an open mind and let us get something moving. 



Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 



Mr. LEisTNOisr. Thank you, Mr. Rogers. 



Mr. Casey, before I yield to you — who, Doctor, of the Bureau of 

 the Budget is on the Federal Cfouncil for Science and Technology? 



Mr. Seidman. The Deputy Director, Elmer Staats, is the Bureau's 

 representative on the council. 



Mr. Lennon. Does he attend, according to your best information, 

 all of the sessions of the Federal Council on Science and Tech- 

 nology ? 



Mr. Seidman. I think he has been very conscientious in attending 

 meetings and where he has been 'unable to do so he has sent JSir. 

 Carey, who is the Executive Assistant Director. Mr. Staats has a 

 very deep and personal interest in the whole field of science and 

 teclinology. 



Mr. Lennon. Doctor, who from the Bureau of the Budget is on 

 the Interagency Committee on Oceanography ? 



Mr. Seidman. Mr. Dillon of the Military Division. 



Mr. Lennox. Is Mr. Dillon here this morning ? 



Mr. Seidman. No, he is not. 



Mr. Lennon. Does he attend the regular sessions of the Interagency 

 Committee on Oceanography ? 



Mr. Seidman. Yes, he does. 



Mr. Berg. As well as some of the subcommittees of that interagency 

 committee also. 



