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Mr. Pellt. In other words, there is a legal power to control carrying 

 pollutant materials through the the territorial sea and on that basis you 

 propose to prevent it from being dumped outside. 



Mr. Train. It is actually the taking from the United States proper, 

 not the passing through the territorial sea. 



Mr. Pelly. In other words, it is an export permit. What legal au- 

 thority would there be for taking material from a port as against going 

 through our sovereign territorial waters ? 



Mr. Train. Well, of course, you could not leave a port without going 

 into the waters but it would be under the commerce power, I presume. 

 We do not by that authority seek to govern the case, for example, where 

 wastes are loaded in a foreign port and for some reason carriod 

 through the U.S. territorial waters and then back out to the high seas 

 somewhere and dumped. We would not seek to assert U.S. jurisdiction 

 over that dumping by this legislation. 



My. Pellt. Does the International Convention on the Law of the 

 Sea give us authority to prevent dumping over the Continental Shelf? 



Mr. Train. If we get into the complexities of international law in 

 this area, you might be better advised to rely on Mr. Stevenson of the 

 State Department. But, I would say this: that our jurisdiction insofar 

 as territorial seas are concerned extends only 3 miles, and 9 miles 

 beyond that to the contiguous ozone. 



Mr. Pelly. Over the bottom, but we don't actually cover the free- 

 swimming fish, for example. 



]Mr. Train. Under the Geneva Convention with respect to the deep 

 seabed we have jurisdiction over the resources of the seabed out to 

 the 200-meter isobath or so much further out as we have the ability 

 to exploit it. I hope I am close to the language. 



Mr. Pelly. You are almost word for word but I just thought per- 

 haps there would be some limit on our power to prevent anybody 

 dumping over our seabed to the extent of 12 miles, the Continental 

 Shelf. 



Mr. Train. We believe that we have complete authority to regulate 

 the dumping by anyone within our territorial waters, no matter from 

 where those wastes come or whether there is any touching at a U.S. 

 port. We likewise believe that we have authority completely to regu- 

 late any such dumping in the contiguous zone to the extent that it 

 could affect the territorial waters or our shores. In effect, we say this 

 gives us authority to regulate ocean dumping within the 12 miles. To 

 the extent that a dumping takes place outside of the 12-mile limit, 

 whether on the Continental Shelf or beyond the Continental Shelf, we 

 do not believe that the United States has unilateral sovereign author- 

 itv to regulate that except where the wastes originate in the United 

 States. 



Mr. Pelly. I think some of the bills that are before the committee 

 actually do seek to control outside the 12-mile limit. 



Mr. Train. They do, sir ; and this is one of the problems to which 

 I have referred in my statement. To the extent that they do seek to 

 regulate dumping on the Outer Continental Shelf bevond the con- 

 tiguous zone where the wastes do not orignate from the United States. 

 we believe there is raised a very serious question under international 

 law. At the same time I go to great pains to point out there is no evi- 

 dence of such dumping so it is not at the present time a real problem. 



