498 



mobiles in certain waters has seemed to create artificial reefs and provided 

 shelter and protection for spawning and young marine life. Some forms of 

 construction of demolition debris composed of dense and inert materials may 

 be similarly used without threat to the ocean. 



Mr. Rogers. As I recall, the only prohibition goes to about three 

 items, don't they? I think they would prohibit radioactive wastes, 

 toxic industrial wastes, and chemical and biological warfare materials. 

 Have you seen in any provisions of the bill any other absolute 

 proliibitions ? 



General Hayes. Well, that is the point. We feel that there aren't 

 really absolute prohibition provisions in H.R. 4723, and that does 

 allow some latitude for accommodation to what further knowledge 

 may indicate to us. 



Mr. Rogers. Well, I thought the Secretary had already ruled out 

 most of these, hasn't he? 



General Hayes. We have done that. That is correct. 



Mr. Rogers. But you said an absolute proliibition. 



General Hayes. For the time being. 



Mr. Rogers. You mean the Secretary is now going to change his 

 mind ? 



General Hayes. It may be found that teclinologically, and tliis is a 

 supposition, that some of the old ammunition, and I am thinking 

 primarily of conventional explosive anununition, that we may not be 

 able to demilitarize it safely on land. We may have to, after due 

 consideration and effort, request an ocean dump. But, we don't know 

 at the present time. Now our goal is not to dump. 



Mr. Rogers. Well, it seems to me the Secretary has already made a 

 determination that this is not a wise procedure, and I think it might 

 be well to strengthen his hand in termination in the law. Then if 

 you need a specific exemption, you could come to ask for a specific 

 act, you know, if it got to that point. 



General Hayes. I can assure you Mr. Rogers, that the Secretary 

 and Ms advisers do not intend to act in any capricious manner. 



Mr. Rogers. Well, it is difficult sometimes even to get all the com- 

 mands to carry out some of the directives. For instance, the Air Force, 

 we just have an example where they have been dumping, as you are 

 probably aware, toxic materials into the California water. 



General Hayes. Well, we have had a preliminary investigation into 

 that already, and from our current information, it appears that the 

 Air Force is complying with the applicable laws and regulations. So 

 I would like to — again for the record — give you a detailed report on 

 that. 



Mr. Rogers. Well, we have checked pretty thoroughly, and we don't 

 agree with your preliminary finding, because the Air Force says they 

 are paying local agencies to do the detoxification, and the local agen- 

 cies say nobody can dump in there until they do the detoxification. 

 But they are not doing it. 



So somebody is not pretty well squared away. 



General Hayes. As I said, our preliminary indication is such, but we 

 Avill have a report for you for the record. 



