104 



and then tries to make that pattern which comes out of an old situa- 

 tion apply to a new one. 



So the first thought is, if you are going to go into the sea you now 

 have NASA in the pattern shop and you have something to work with. 



I notice in contrast private industry finds their comfort — and that is 

 actually what the politician is looking for, comfort and understanding 

 of the situation — they find it by keeping the name of the game the 

 same. When we rode in the stagecoach we called it a coach, when the 

 trains came along and had a new way of traveling, they kept the coach, 

 when the buses came along the first buses I ever saw that carried people 

 were called coaches. 



I notice when you go on a streamlined jet you still get a ticket on 

 the coach. So they provide the name is the same as the game goes on, 

 and I wish the politician would adopt more of that technique rather 

 than the pattern shop technique. I think we have to find, Mr. Chair- 

 man, either the lead agency technique or a new concept that will give 

 the taxpayer the maximum bang for the buck or at least the maximum 

 coverage for his cash. He is entitled to getting everything out of these 

 singular missions that is possible. 



Let me ask you a specific question and bring up this business of co- 

 ordination and cooperation on the Hill. 



Are you aware of an organization in the Navy called NOTS ? 



Admiral Waters. Yes, sir. 



Mr. Hanna. Does that come under your responsibilities. Admiral? 



Admiral Waters. The one that used to be up until a few weeks ago 

 called NOTS Pasadena was under my aegis, so to speak, in a limited 

 way. They are one of the laboratories that have as a part of their 

 broad program things that contribute to this overall program I 

 manage. 



Mr. Hanna. I notice you made reference to Dr. Frosch and it was 

 my understanding he had a very singular connection and important 

 connection with NOTS' operation; it that correct? 



Admiral Waters. Yes, sir. 



Mr. Hanna. And it does come under the research-and-development 

 aspect of the Navy, right ? 



Admiral Waters. The point I was making it that NOTS China 

 Lake is really oriented toward air-type weapons, NOTS Pasadena was 

 an outgrowth of that which went into the water mainly with torpedoes, 

 and now in the new organization NOTS Pasadena is called the Naval 

 Undersea Warfare Center and draws on the capability of certain 

 scientists and engineers located in San Diego at the old Naval Elec- 

 tronic Laboratory. They have been grouped, so to speak, as a task 

 force. 



related to ordnance or weapons in the sea, it has to relate to ocean- 

 Mr. Hanna. Whatever mission they have in terms of whether 

 ography ; does it not ? 



Admiral Waters. Yes, sir. 



Mr. Hanna. To the science of oceanography ? 



Admiral Waters. Yes, sir. Please understand that I do not manage 

 the development of weapons systems, however, only the environ- 

 mental or ocean engineering in their support. 



Mr. Hanna. If you would provide us with what you know about 

 the plan for the expansion of their capability in E.. & D. and how — 



