223 



In addition to that, the Department is funding thermal gradient 

 development as part of the solar thermal energy program. 



Mr. Studds. Maybe I have the same misunderstanding here. You 

 fund a portion of a study being conducted by Southern California 

 Edison, do you not? 



Dr. Katz. That is solar thermal. 



Mr. Studds. It is also solar thermal? 



Dr. Katz. Yes. 



Mr. Studds. I think you made reference to this a moment ago. It 

 has been suggested that because wave energy devices remove part 

 of the energy obviously from waves approaching the coast, that a 

 string of them might in some cases serve the same coastal protec- 

 tion purposes as a breakwater or some other form of solid construc- 

 tion in the ocean. 



Is this a potential benefit worth pursuing, and have you looked 

 at that at all? 



Dr. Katz. We believe there is a potential benefit to the deploy- 

 ment of wave energy conversion devices to increase the stability of 

 beaches. We have reviewed it to see what effect it would have on 

 beaches, and apparently, analytically it could have a stabilizing 

 effect. 



It is possible that a wave device could be even more effective 

 than a breakwater system in this regard. 



Mr. Studds. I must say now that I have asked the question I 

 tremble a little bit at the thought of trying to actually implement 

 such a thing, playing around with Mother Nature with that degree 

 of arrogance and to that extent of ignorance. You really wonder 

 what it is you are doing. 



Dr. Katz. I agree with you in this case, and I think Mr. 

 Richards'surfers would also be disturbed. 



Mr. Studds. I wasn't so much thinking of the surfers. 



Are you from California, Mr. Richards? 



Mr. Richards. No, sir, I was born and raised in Washington, D.C. 

 I just spent 10 years in California. 



Mr. Studds. I really wasn't thinking of the surfers. I was think- 

 ing of the grander elements of nature, and the fact that we have 

 found, as I understand it, that every time we have built a break- 

 water or a jetty or any kind of riprap, that while we may have 

 accomplished at least for the moment our purpose in that particu- 

 lar place, we have brought upon ourselves subsequent and conse- 

 quent results elsewhere along the coastline that had not been 

 anticipated, planned or desired. 



Dr. Katz. Those of us who have been down at Nags Head know 

 that Mother Nature rather does what she wants. 



Mr. Studds. Yes, not even the Department of Energy sometimes 

 can stop her. 



On page 7, you make reference to environmental concerns in 

 general. Have you taken a look at whether taking substantial 

 energy from the Gulf Stream might affect the ocean conditions 

 which foster the extraordinary productivity of the Georges Bank 

 fishery off New England? 



Dr. Katz. We do not have any conclusive studies in that area at 

 this time. We have consulted with oceanographers both at Scripps 

 and at Woods Hole. They express the opinion that they do not 



