722 
is going to have to be studied in depth, and I want to ask the counsel 
to do that and to try to bring back to the committee at some subsequent 
meeting a definitive explanation, you being an engineer and we being 
laymen, to counsel and advise us as to the direction that you want us 
to go here. 
On page 6 you say that : 
The resolution of these questions is a matter of concern for the Sea Grant 
program: cost-sharing, contract definition, motivation of industry to become a 
partner with universities, quality control in education and research, effective 
use of research for economic growth, communication with university policy 
makers, utilization of industrial research and educational talents. 
This next sentence I want you to talk about : 
The investigation and resolution of these issues is essential to the realistic 
implementation of the broad national ocean goals. 
I want the counsel to take that paragraph and take that last sentence 
and see if we can relate that to what our responsibility is. 
I think you recognize, sir, that in the field of leg islation the legis- 
lation is usually broad. If we implement the commission’s report in 1 its 
entirety through legislation some of the things that you are talking 
about here, I believe a good part of what you are addressing yourself 
to here, will ultimately have to be resolved by the agency assuming 
that it is a Government structure and particularly by the National 
Advisory Committee if we implement the commission’s report in creat- 
ing this National Advisory Committee. 
Is that a fair summary of the situation that I have just laid out, 
ta 
3) 
Dr. Grirris. Mr. Chairman, this is a very precise understanding of 
the points which have been emphasized in this brief presentation. albet 
me comment that I see the successful implementation of a national 
program perhaps in three levels or phases of effort. 
There is an initial, current phase—let me call it intuitive, for lack 
of a better word—intuitive under standing of the direction (not 
entirely intuitive but based on experience and board philosophy as to 
the direction) of reorganization that we ought to take in implement- 
ing such a major national program. 
Second, there is the phase of operational planning which needs to 
be anticipated before the final organizational pattern is put into con- 
crete, let us say, in order to build on past experience and past evolution 
of effectiveness of interfacing Government, industry and education 
to achieve national goals. Third, there is the implementation i in detail, 
the administration, ‘and the details of operation, the spending of the 
dollars, the problem solving. 
At the present state of legislation we are at this initial time when 
intuition, when experience is being judged, when broad philos- 
ophies are being set up in the form of concepts and objectives 
for reorganization. 
J am attempting to suggest that we are aware cf the evolut'on that 
has taken place, let us say, since the time of World War II in the 
successful nuclear energy activities which have become a national pro- 
gram, with the consequent interfacing of Government and industry 
and education, including all aspects of education. We have had an- 
other amazingly successful program interfacing Government and 
education and industry in the space program. 
