850 
On pages 19 and 20 you make reference to the losses affected agencies 
would suffer. You say this must be evaluated. Is the real question what 
DOT, Department of Transportation, or some other agency would 
lose, or what the Nation would gain? Maybe you had better stop there 
and answer that question. Are we considering what agencies would 
lose by this proposal or are we considering the broad spectrum of what 
the Nation would gain? Which do we do first ? 
Dr. Wenn. Well, Mr. Chairman, the national interest has to come 
first, without any question, but in considering what the agencies would 
lose, my phraseology perhaps was poor. I did not mean to suggest this 
was simply to be evaluated in narrow, parochial interests of the agency 
in preserving their own stature, but rather the question of effectiveness 
of carrying out a statutory mission. I believe that the yardstick for 
evaluating these alternatives is only the national interest and not the 
question of preserving the integrity of an agency for its own sake. 
Mr. Lennon. When you speak of the Department of Interior and 
think of their jurisdiction over, say, commercial fishing to fishing on 
the high seas, it is a little bit difficult to relate isn’t it? Of course, you 
can relate it perhaps to sport fishing inland, but it is a little difficult to 
relate it to our commercial fishing fleet and the problems we are having 
in the Atlantic and Pacific. 
Now, let’s take the Department of Transportation. Suppose the 
Coast Guard was moved out of the Department of Transportation. 
How would the Department of Transportation suffer except for the 
fact it would lose the stature of the agency that had the greatest Gov- 
ernment payroll or greatest Government personnel? How could it 
affect the Department of Transportation if the Coast Guard was moved 
out when only 4 percent of the activity of the Coast Guard is related to 
merchant marine? Isn’t that true, according to the findings of the 
commission which is specifically so stated on page 237 ? 
Dr. Wenk. With regard to the Commission’s report, this percentage 
of the Coast Guard’s activity related to merchant marine inspection 
and safety, the percentage you cite is certainly correct, but there are 
a number of activities where the involvement of the Coast Guard with 
other sister agencies within the Department of Transportation is 
important, and let me recite one. 
Incidentally, in so doing, I am not trying to make the case one way 
or the other, but just from the point of view of answering your ques- 
tion, the Department of Transportation was asked by the Marine 
Council to develop a plan for the future of navigation aids, recogniz- 
ing that in order to develop this, there needed to be close collaboration 
between the Federal Aviation Agency and the Coast Guard. The tech- 
nology that is involved here with regard to locating or keeping track 
of planes has application to the problem of keeping track of ships, 
especially as they enter crowded harbors. 
‘So this would be the kind of benefit that could be obtained from 
these two agencies being within the same department. 
Mr. Lennon. We do know that the Coast Guard is concerned about 
this, not only the Department of Transportation, because of the pos- 
sible loss of lead agency based on Government personnel. They are con- 
cerned that in their everyday activities they would be subjugated, that 
the scientific and marine aspect would get superior emphasis. Of course, 
they have these well-defined statutory responsibilities on a day by day 
