920 
We think that the question of a separate agency is one alternative, 
but it is not the only way to meet it, and here are the capabilities we 
have to offer. Here is the best assessment we can make of what would 
result from various transfers. These are things that certainly must be 
in this agency if it is to do its mission. Here are things that are mar- 
ginal for consideration. 
And that is about where we would have to leave it, at that point. 
Mr. Rogers. I see. So, at least you have not come to a departmental 
position either in favor of or in opposition to a separate oceanographic 
agenc 
Dr. Micous I think our whole approach has been to say that this 
involves things that go beyond the Department of Commerce. It has 
to do with the spirit with which the administration wants to organize, 
the effectiveness of various approaches, and then stop at that point. 
Mr. Rocrrs. Yes. Well, I commend you for that. I think at least 
you have not come out in opposition toa new idea. 
Of course, as I am sure you know, the whole thrust of what we are 
trying to aim at is to put emphasis on the development of the ocean. 
Dr. Trisus. Yes; and this is the point that I have tried to make in 
this testimony : that i is, to develop a civilian activity in the ocean that 
contributes to the economy. It goes without saying, that a lot of private 
investors must be encouraged to go into the ocean and spend their 
money to do something because they think they can provide a service 
and make a profit. 
Now, the fostering of that activity requires that the agency that does 
it have the capability of dealing with industry in such a way as to 
bring this about. Such an agency ; should not set itself up as an agency 
that 1s going to start all over again and either learn how to do economic 
development or assume somehow or other that economic development 
will occur over there somewhere without their active participation. 
Mr. Rocers. Well, I see the point you are making, but I must say I 
have some concern when I look at the American merchant marine and 
what has happened to that. 
Dr. Trius. Yes; I think you have a right to be concerned. 
Mr. Rogers. Perhaps a new agency with new, fresh ideas, not im- 
peded by the formula of asking so much for this activity and not where 
they have such timidity in asking for sufficient funds to do the task, 
maybe this is what we need, and I think the Commission thought that. 
Dr. Trisus. Yes. That is a way to go at it, but it is not the only way. 
Another way is to say, “We have a good beginning in an agency 
such as MarAd, and now let’s build it into what we want,” and this is 
what the present administrator is doing. I think his program at the 
Woods Hole Conference is very imaginative. 
I didn’t mention in my prepared testimony the work that is going 
on with the surface effects ships program. This is very impressive. 
There is a lot of new activity going on. 
Mr. Rocerrs. I am sure that is so, and this has come about in the last 
5 or 6 months, but in looking at the history of the development, it is not 
too impressive. 
Dr. Trius. I tend to agree with that. 
Mr. Rocrrs. I am concerned, too, at this. For instance, what is 
your construction budget for ESSA ? Is it $3 million ? 
