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EPA. I was wondering while you’re developing these types of facili- 
ties—and I commend you for doing it—why are you not going into 
that type of facility which would not have the byproduct of sludge. 
Mr. McGoucu. When we started back in 1978 to plan to meet 
the deadline, we examined every available alternative, including 
incineration, pyrolysis, land disposal of various types, and so forth. 
The majority of our sludge has a heavy metals problem. Our analy- 
sis indicated that incineration or pyrolysis adversely affected the 
air—and that the technology had not advanced far enough, given 
our sludges, to permit us to incinerate. We continue to assess alter- 
natives. If a technology develops that can handle our sludges, we 
will certainly pursue it. But what we had found to date as the best 
alternative was the composting alternative, even with our serious 
concerns about it, and the fact that, at most, it was only a 7-year 
interim solution. 
Mr. Carney. I have been notified that my time has expired, Mr. 
Mayor, and I would just leave you with an old Jewish prayer—— 
Mr. D’Amours. All the time of all the members have expired, 
and I am going to make this suggestion to the members. Every 
member here, Ed, you will be happy to know, has more questions. 
We will pose our questions very quickly and ask you to submit the 
answers for the record, because we have to get you out of here and 
we have to get out of here to get some lunch. 
You have listed a great many costs the city is currently bearing 
in its effort to deal with its sewage and runoff problems. I wonder 
if you could have the people with you and your staff submit to the 
panel for the record a total listing of these projects and all the 
costs associated with them? Could you do that? 
Mayor Kocu. Let me make a suggestion, Mr. Chairman. What- 
ever questions you have that you want to submit to us, we will re- 
spond to them. 
Mr. D’Amours. Can you do that for the record? 
Mayor Kocu. Yes. We will do every one of them, to the best of 
our ability. 
Mr. D’Amours. Thank you. 
Mr. Evans. 
Mr. Evans. Yes, Mr. Chairman. 
Mr. Mayor, could you give me the cost per ton of dumping 
sewage sludge at the 12, 60, and 106-mile sites? And in addition, 
have you asked the State of New York to assist in locating onland 
disposal sites? 
Mayor Kocu. We will respond to that, sure. 
Mr. D’Amours. Mr. Hughes. 
Mr. HuGuHEs. Yes, Mr. Chairman. 
I would like, Mayor, if you would furnish me for the record, first 
of all, the number of tons of toxic, organic materials, PCB’s, mer- 
cury, cadmium, lead, copper and so forth, that are disposed in the 
ocean each year out of New York City. 
Second of all, I would like to find out what contingency plans do 
you have in the event EPA determines that you have sludge that 
unreasonably degrades the environment. Specifically, what sites 
seus have available, and how you are going to dispose of that 
sludge. 
