343 
bight, but it certainly is true—and NOAA has acknowledged as 
much—that the New York Bight, and particularly the New York 
Bight apex, is one of the most severely degraded coastal environ- 
ments in the entire world. 
The sorts of things that are quite common in the bight apex are 
fin rot, gill erosion, skin tumors, parasitic infestation of the gills of 
fish that are present in the bight, Chromosome breakage, damaged 
embryonic development, has been observed in mackerel embryos in 
the vicinity of dumpsites within the bight apex. 
Measurements that have been made of levels of uptake not only 
of PCB’s and heavy metals, but also of carcinogenic polynuclear 
aromatic hydrocarbons [PAH] have found significant, and to me 
very disturbing, concentrations of PCB’s and PAH’s in just about 
every fish and shellfish tissue sampled within the bight apex. I, for 
one, would have great qualms about eating seafood that came any- 
where from that area. 
Mr. Evans. That was one of the reasons for the law that we es- 
tablished here in 1977 and reconfirmed again in 1980. However, the 
Administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency questioned 
our intent. I think she was wrong. Being one of the authors, I 
should know what we meant. The record clearly indicated that we 
meant that there would be a specific deadline. 
We hear over and over again, Mr. Kamlet, that it is more dan- 
gerous to keep sewage sludge on land than it is to dump it in the 
ocean. I am not a scientist; I am a generalist. However, it seems to 
me that it is a lot easier to contain toxic substances on land than it 
would be to have them out there in the ocean in the currents and 
subject to the vagaries of Mother Nature. Could you give me your 
comment? 
Mr. KAMLteT. I would be happy to do so. You are a very percep- 
tive generalist, I might suggest. I think that is right. As Captain 
Cousteau indicated, the thing that one wants to guard against, 
whether you are talking about waste disposal on land or in the 
ocean, is to prevent contamination of the water. If you dispose of 
material in the ocean, you know that it is inevitable that you are 
going to contaminate the water because that is where you are pur- 
posely putting the material. 
On land, on the other hand, there are management techniques 
that are available to prevent the ground water or surrounding sur- 
face waters from being centaminated in the first place. Even if you 
err and problems do arise, the opportunity to intervene and correct 
those problems is far greater on land than it is in the ocean. 
Mr. Evans. Once you have dumped in the ocean, it seems to me 
that what you have done is irretrievable, irreparable, or certainly 
could be. Captain Cousteau was with us this morning and was talk- 
ing about the checks that we are writing now that we are drafting 
on someone else’s account, a future generation. I believe we must 
preserve some of the things that we have on this Earth for future 
generations. 
How do you feel about New York State helping New York City 
find an onland disposal site? Do you know? 
Mr. Kam et. I just do not know. 
