596 



Mrs. Boxer. But at this point, the EPA position is we should not 

 ehminate the dumping of certain levels of waste into the ocean, be- 

 cause you really don't feel that you have got substantial data to 

 show that it is harmful to the food chain? 



Mr. Sjoblom. We haven't taken a position on whether or not 

 dumping should be done in this country, no, ma'am. 



Mrs. Boxer. Will you be taking that position? 



Mr. Sjoblom. Only if there is a permit application. 



Mrs. Boxer. And the Navy? 



Mr. Sjoblom. That is the requirement under the law. 



Mrs. Boxer. I understand, I am not criticizing, I am trying to get 

 to the point when you make your wisdom known to the world. I 

 would assume maybe the Navy application will be pursued. That 

 might be the time you would in fact speak out on this issue. 



Mr. Sjoblom. Possibly. 



Mrs. Boxer. Thank you very much. 



It has been very helpful. 



Mr. D' Amours. What was the answer to the last question, when 

 this is going to be officially or formally released? Was that an- 

 swered? 



Mrs. Boxer. I believe we have been informed when a permit ap- 

 plication is applied for, then the EPA will speak out as to whether 

 or not they feel it is a risk or not. They will use that as the vehicle. 



Mr. D'Amours. OK, I have one last question, and it is directed 

 mostly to the State Department I assume, Mary Rose, you are 

 going to Noumea? 



Ms. Hughes. No, unfortunately, I will not be going. 



Mr. D'Amours. Is that because of your termination with the 

 agency? 



Ms. Hughes. No. 



Mr. D'Amours. I thought you were staying on because you 

 wanted to go to Noumea and stay at some of their exquisite hotels, 

 like the Basil. But it is important to make this point an5rway on 

 the Noumea or South Pacific Regional Convention. 



The United States is going to be there, and I understand from 

 your testimony that the position that we are going to take there is 

 going to be identical to the position we took in London, that is, to 

 oppose the attempt by this regional conference to impose a morato- 

 rium similar to the moratorium that the U.S. Congress has passed, 

 that is now the law of the land. 



It just frustrates me terribly — I am not going to be at this one, 

 and I don't know if any of my staff will but it frustrates me that 

 the United States so cavalierly gives up its world leadership role in 

 this area, even to the extent of taking positions that are inconsist- 

 ent with its own laws. Having been in London and having seen the 

 frantic last-minute attempts of yourself, Eric Eidsness and John 

 Hernandez, the latter two of which have gone on to other pastures, 

 as we know, it just frustrates me to see that we are going to fall 

 into that same situation and once again give up our world leader- 

 ship on the protection of oceanic environment. 



Do I understand your testimony correctly that in fact, even given 

 the last-minute attempts to save face in London, that we are going 

 to go into this convention with the same position that we took in 



