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Mr. Grover. You are not referring to those who are despoiline the 
g Pp g Ul 
Hudson but those who are dumping the chemicals. 
Mr. Orrincer. No, [ am talking about the industries. Take for in- 
stance the photographic industries which discharge silver in their 
waste. That silver is a highly dangerous material which stays in the 
sludge when it is dumped into the ocean. The photographie compa- 
nies ought to be required to remove it. In many cases we have found 
that it becomes economical or near economical to remove it. I have a 
number of examples where companies that have been required to re- 
cover such materials as sulphur and chlorine from their waste actual- 
ly find the reclaimed material to be as valuable as or, in some cases, 
more valuable than the original product. Even where this is not true, 
companies must be required to take such materials out of the waste 
before they dump into public waste disposal systems. It is absolutely 
essential because the danger to public health and the environment is 
so great. 
Mr. Grover. That is not within the purview of the bill. 
Mr. Orrrncer. That is not within the purview of this bill, but it is an 
action which should be taken. Then this will remove a serious threat 
from the wastes, but it won’t solve the problem of what you do with 
tremendous volumes of sludge and spoil during the interim time 
while you build high temperature incinerators or build the processes 
necessary to convert sewage sludge into agricultural fertilizer. The 
best suggestion that we can give, after consultation with Dr. Pearce 
and other marine biologists, is that the matter be dumped further out 
beyond the Continental Shelf. There is a substantial body of scientific 
opinion that holds that the sewage may be beneficial, if it is spread on 
the top of the water in certain areas further out on the continental 
shelf. It contains nutrients that that particular area of the ocean 
badly needs. At any rate, it will be of minimal ecological harm, as 
compared to the very great damage and threat of damage that is oc- 
curring by dumping it so close to New York Harbor and into other 
coastal waters. It may well cost more, but the municipalities involved 
in the dumping will have to pay the extra price. 
Mr. Grover. The price is going to have to be paid if the water is 
coing to survive. I am thinking of the time to build the facilities. 
Mr. Orrrncrr. In the interim period our suggestion is that the 
Corps of Engineers, Congress, the Government acting through what- 
ever body it chooses ought to require the dumping of these materials 
out far enough so that they won’t threaten the beaches, and so that 
they won’t threaten the marine resources that provide one of the chief 
genet: of revenue and occupation to the people of the city of New 
ork. 
Mr. Grover. I would think that having figured out it be dumped 
into the Continental Shelf you may be running into the Gulf Stream. 
Mr. Orrrncrr. Not necessarily. The new dumping area will have to 
be chosen with great care and after intensive scientific study. Here I 
think Dr. Pearce would be helpful. 
Mr. Grover. I want to make one other point. We are talking about 
the problem of dumping this sludge into the Bight, which again IT 
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