195 



considered m the reorganization, one of the most important of wliich 

 is to get moving in the field of long-range engineering developmeiit 

 which, in the present governmental setnp, system, is ineffective. It 

 suffers, and as a result our whole program falls flat on its face. 



Mr. Rogers. So the present setup is not working ? 



Dr. Kavanagii. Yes. 



Mr. Rogers. And we need the reorganization. This is your testimony, 

 although you are not giving us the specifics as to what an organization 

 should be? 



Dr. Kavaxagh. Yes. 



Mr. Rogers. But you agree in principle that we need to have a new 

 approach and new organizational setup ? ^ 



Dr. Kavaxagh. Yes, but in essence I also indicated that since engi- 

 neers do get involved in politics, we would be happy to look at this 

 problem from that viewpoint because engineering does involve all 

 aspects of man's activities, including social problems, economic prob- 

 lems, and political problems as well. 



We simply have not felt that it was within our jurisdiction to com- 

 ment on the detail of organization in our studies. We concentrated on 

 functional requirements. 



Mr. Rogers. I understand. I think it would be helpful. 



Dr. E^vanagh. Our Panel people will be happy to be available and 

 in fact would welcome the opportunity to testify in any respect in this 

 connection. 



Mr. Rogers. Thank you. ■ 



Mr. Lennon. Thank you, Doctor. 



Mr. Drewry ? 



Mr. Drewry. Dr. Kavanagh, this is sort of a leading question. Hasn't 

 it long been — or all the way back to the time when Lincoln set up the 

 National Academy of Sciences — pretty much the policy of the Xa- 

 tional Academies that, being made up of citizens who are making con- 

 tributions to aid the Government, that your policy has been that you 

 stay away from areas which are of a governmental policy or political 

 policy level and that you don't feel that it is appropriate in your posi- 

 tion as an Academy to go into the point of recommendations with re- 

 spect to how such things should be done ? 



Dr. Kavanagh. Yes. Fundamentally I thought I stated this to the 

 chairman, but I am not sure whether I stated it as well as you did. 



The I^ational Academy, any national academy is an independent, un- 

 biased organization, and therefore it does not go in and sell any par- 

 ticular problem to Congress or to the Government. We can furnish 

 advice on policy matters. 



Mr. Drewry. When we go into looking over this list which already 

 contains names which we intend to invite or who have asked to be 

 heard, then the}' will be appearing as individuals and can say what- 

 ever they feel ? 



Dr. Kavanagh. Absolutely. 



Mr. Rogers. Will the gentleman yield ? 



I presume if we asked you for ad^dce on this, there would be nothing 

 to prevent it ? 



Dr. Kavanagh. As an individual, yes. 



Mr. Rogers. What about as a group ? Suppose we ask you ? 



