359 



pi-(>;;rcim, imlfss it iii ainendod along the lines that you have suggested in your 

 statement. And I agree with that. 



I am inclined to go the full way, myself, but I can perhaps see, as you have 

 pointed out so clearly, the disadvantages certainly for the next reasonable period 

 of time in going that far, in establishing a separate and independent agency such 

 as we have in the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. 



We got shot down by the executive branch of the Government on 

 that bill of establishing this National Oceanographic Council which 

 would be a nonoperating agency such as you have indicated. 



So, when the distinguished Chairman left and went to chair the 

 Coimnittee on Astronautics and Space and the distinguished ranking 

 member went to chair the Subcommittee on Fisheries and Wildlife 

 Conservation, the resjDonsibility then fell on me. 



We had a series of hearings that lasted months and tried to cover 

 everything like we are trying to cover it now, and we established the 

 Commission and mandated them to make the study in depth, to make 

 the recommendations based upon their individual studies, their con- 

 centrations with every facet of the marine sciences here and even 

 abroad through their separate panels, and tell us what in their judg- 

 ment we should do. 



We decided at that time that we ought to also establish a national 

 council. We there again met with obstinancies and friction and even 

 the all-out effort to cripple us in our efforts to establish it. We did it 

 in spite of the administration, and it is the finest thing that we ever 

 did. 



So that I find myself at this point, here in 1969, almost 8 years later. 

 And are you satisfied with the way we are moving now in this broad 

 program ? I find myself in agreement with you in your colloquy with 

 the gentleman from California with respect to the fact that, as to the 

 oceanographic vessels that we built through ESSA, the Department 

 of the Interior and some others, maybe that money ought to be spent 

 in programs and not in capital inprovements. 



I have come to the conclusion, and tried to keep an open mind about 

 this, tliat we must bring together a governmental structure as recom- 

 mended by this Commission, who I think are conscientious people. 

 Perhaps even more important is the establishment of the National Ad- 

 visory Council that the Commission recommended, which I think 

 would play a very important part in bringing together and focusing 

 upon the governmental structure, the private sector which you so 

 clearly indicated is the one which is going to be primarily responsible 

 for the exploitation of the oceans' resources. 



Would you want to comment on my remarks? 



Mr. Beckmann. Yes. I think that when the Interagency Committee 

 on Oceanography was formed, it was a very good idea. They have 

 made a lot of useful suggestions through the years but unfortunately 

 that is all they have ever been in a position to do. 



Mr. Lennon. What? 



Mr. Beckmann. I say that is all they have ever been in a position 

 to do is to make suggestions. 



Mr. Lennon. They were not at a sufficient level so that they could 

 make a policy. 



Mr. Beckmann. Well, they couldn-t make a policy. More impor- 

 tantly, they didn't have any money, no funding of their own, or funds 

 they could control. Therefore, they could never get anything done. 



