mmm 



i 



375 



Mr. Thomson. — On page 67 Mr. Dana says : — 



" Now, t.lie.sc fislieviiu'ii slinuld iidt la' rxclmlcd cxoppt from nooessity, some kind of upcessity, 

 and r ;im willing; to juit at 3tiik(^ vliatpvcr little ivimtation T may have as a ])prson acqiiaintpd with 

 thp Jnri«pnid('ii(c of iialioiis, (and ilip Ipss ic]mtntion, tlip iiiorc imjiortaiil to imi) to maintain this 

 l)i'o|)ositioM, that the dupp-spa tinhprm,in, [misuinj,' tlip frpp-swimniin^' tish of the oppaii with his not, 

 or hi,s ii-adpil line, not loiiphini,' siioiv^ or tronlilinj,' liip liollnni of ihe spa. is no tipspiiSHpr, though lip 

 upproanliP^ within tinup milps of a p(iast, by any pstahlishud, ivcugnized law of all n.itiunn." 



Now, I say tliat the nieanlug of that proposition is thi^, that there are no such things 

 as territorial waters. I say it means tliat and nothing else. Tliat is a distinet affirmation, 

 that hy internationnl law any fisherman can approacli within not merely three miles of 

 the coast, bnt within any distance from the coast, if hei<ecpshis leaded line from touching 

 the bottom, and the keel of hi^; vessel from touching the land, and that no international 

 law excludes him. Upon that extraordinary proposition I take direct and unqualified 

 issue. 



Mr. Dana. — What is the; jirojiosition to which you refer? 



Mr. Thomson. — The proposition was that tiiere are no such things as territorial 

 waters. 



Mr. Dana. — I made no such proposition. The question was this — was there among 

 territorial rights the rigiit to exclude fishermen from fishing ? 



Mr. Thomson. — 1 did say this, that Mr. Dana had put forward the proposition that 

 no nation possessed territorial waters. But no doubt that was too broad, because there 

 may be territorial waters so enclosed by land that I presume no question could arise in 

 regard to them, thcrelbre 1 stated his proposition too br ''y. But Mr. Dana does not 

 confine his statement to tiio one that no nation has absolute territorial rights over waters. 

 He says that any foreign tisherman can come within any distance of tiie shores, and if he 

 does not allow his leaded line or tlie keel of his vessel to touch the bottom, he has an 

 undoubted right to fish. 



Mr. Dana. — There is no established recognized law of all nations against it. 



Mr. Thomson. — Mr. Dana says, •* by any established, recognized law of all nations." 

 I do not wish to have any fencing about words ; I use words in their ordinary meaning. 

 I presume Mr. Dana means civilized nations. I do not .suppose he will contend that, if 

 the civilized nations of luu'ope and America had recocnized a doctrine totally different from 

 that enunciated by him, but the King of Ashantee or .Siam or some other potentate away 

 off in the interior of the vast Continents of Asia and Africa had not acceded to that 

 doctrine, it was not therefore the law of nations. 1 presume he refers to the civilized 

 nations. I will now sliow the (-ommission that the proposition sul)mittod by .Mr. Dana has 

 no foundation in international law. I say again, that 1 understand the expression to mean 

 all civilizpd nations. 



I undertake to j)rove the contrary of that proposition to be true, not only by inter- 

 national law writers in Kngland, but also by tiie writers in the United States. T.iking up 

 the English writers, I call your attention to I. Philliinore, page 180. edition of 18"}4, at 

 which lie says : — 



" I'x'sidps the riLdit.s of jiropprty and junsdiotion within llip limit of cannon .shot from thp shove, 

 tliPi'p arp pertain )iurtions of IJn' ^>m which. tho\igh tlipy c.xpppd this vprgp, may, under sppcial 

 pinannstanpps, lie prpspvihpd lor." 



The writer tliere assumed that in regard to the three mile line there was no doubt 

 about it. Sir llobert I'hillimore furthor wrote; — 



"Marilinip Irnilorial righls rxipiid, as a gpiipral rulp nvpr arms of thp sea, bays, gulfs, cstuavips, 

 which arp cnclo.icd, but imt entirely sinTiaindcd bv land, bidonging to oup iuni the sanip state'' 



Not only does Sir Robert Philllmore lay down the law that round the coast of any 

 maritime nation, to the extent of three miles, its territorial waters flow, but he goes further, 

 and savs that in the case of estuaries and bays, inclosed within lic-adlands, such estuaries 

 and bavs belong to the State. That would have been an authority, bad the headland 

 (luestion prr .sr , come up for argument. 1 state it, however, for another purpose. That is 

 an authority which at all events shows the views of one of the greatest writers on Inter- 

 national Law upon the subject under discussion. 



Mr. Dana. — Is there anything said about fisheries. 



Mr. Thomson. — I have read the passage, and will hand you the book, if you desire it. 



Mr. Dana. — ^The question is, whetlier among the rights is there one to exclude 

 fishermen. 



[280] 3 D 2 



