43 



Once again, I emphasize that the legislation gives the States broad 

 latitude in working out tlie way best suited to their own institutions 

 and their own traditions for implementing their plans. 



Mr. Anderson. Is it only the States and the local governments that 

 will implement the plan ? 



Mr. Train. That is the Avay this legislation is drawn. 



Mr. Anderson. Didn't you say in another part of the bill, that 

 "^'nothing in this section shall be construed to diminish either Federal 

 jurisdiction" and already the Federal Government has jurisdiction in 

 many of these area ? 



Mr. Train. That is correct. But this bill does not interfere with any 

 existing Government programs. 



Mr. Anderson. When the Federal authority in an area that is now 

 under Federal jurisdiction comes up against the jurisdiction of the 

 States and local governments — if you are going to have a Federal plan 

 that 570U have approved and yet allow the State to implement it — what 

 liappens to the jurisdiction of the Federal Government ? 



Mr. Train. I am not sure of your case, Mr. Anderson. 



Mr. Anderson. I don't have a particular case. I am thinking of sev- 

 eral possible instances. 



Mr. Train. We are talking essentially here about private lands. 



Mr. Anderson. Not entirely. 



Mr. Train. No-t entirely : no, sir. That is perfectly true. But, I think 

 to a very great extent the shorelines of the United States, both coastal 

 shorelines and the Great Lakes shorelines, are in private ownership. 

 I don't know what the percentage is, but certainly a predominant per- 

 centage is in private ownership ; perhaps not counting Alaska, because 

 I suspect Alaska contains maybe more than half of the coastline of the 

 United States ; and most of that is public domain. So that there are 

 really very few Federal programs that would be involved. 



Most — well I would say. essentially all — control over private land is 

 a matter of State and local jurisdiction. There is no Federal regulation 

 of the use of private lands that I know of. 



Mr. Anderson. One last question tliat I had wanted to ask the Secre- 

 tary befo're he had to leave. He had been talking about control. The 

 only real control that you have, as I see it, would be the withholding of 

 grant money. I think he used the words "for the time being," and "as 

 a start." 



Do you intend to go beyond this at a later date with other types of 

 muscle to enforce its provisions ? 



Mr. Train. I don't recall exactly 



Mr. Anderson. Something like that. I think he used the words "for 

 the tim.e being." and I think he said later "as a start." 



]VIr. Train. Without referring back to any earlier statement, I would 

 say that — as the Secretary did — we consider this legislation a 

 first step and we are. as I said, plowing new ground here. It is a re- 

 form. I think it provides a somov/hat basic departure in many ways, 

 from previous practice. And I think we will want to learn from tliat 

 experience and I think that as we gain that experience and as we more 

 clearly understand both the needs and ways of dealing with people, 

 that Congress and the executive branch and the States will be improv- 

 ing, adding to, and expanding the scope of this basic authority. 



Mr. Anderson. Thank you. 



