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In announcing the plans. ]Mr. Clinton said, "We are going to pol- 

 lute, it is only a question of how much. But I think with proper mar- 

 keting and proper construction, we are not going to pollute this area. 

 We are going to contribute to the pollution of the world. Plans call 

 for piping the effluent into the ocean." 



XoAv what is the Department's authority, if at all, to combat that, 

 and what is your reaction to that ? 



Secretary Hickel. I think that is a very, very unwise statement 

 for Clinton Oil to make. If they pollute any part of water under our 

 jurisdiction, they will have me to contend with and I would much 

 rather not have that hap])en to them, because we are not about to let ar- 

 rogance like this — I think that is an arrogant statement. I haven't read 

 it. That is the kind of arrogance that industry doesn't need. If they 

 want to challenge me and pollute just because they think they can 

 pollute. I invite them to try it. 



Senator Hoixings. And you think you have sufficient authority 

 now — 



Secretary Hickel. I will find the authority. With that kind of 

 statement, I would find the authority, Mr. Chairman. That aggra- 

 vates me. 



Senator Hollixgs. And if vou didn't have it. vou would ask us 

 for it ? 



Secretary Hickel. I might even act and ask you to protect me later. 

 Because I wouldn't wait for that kind of thing to happen. I think 

 that is ridiculous. They ought to be ostracized, from the standpoint 

 of industry, by making a statement like that. That is the problem 

 they have. I am not their problem; I am their solution. 



Senator Hollings. Now, i\Ir. Secretary, I have been taking a good 

 bit of the time. I want to yield to mv distingnished colleague before 

 I get into some other items about the bills here. 



Senator Baker ? 



Senator Baker. I must say, ]SIr. Chairman, my principal concern 

 at the moment is to look around the audience and see if I can find 

 steam i-ising. You and the Secretary had such an energetic colloquy 

 going I am reluctant to interevene. 



I have only a general observation to make. I arrived late and did not 

 hear all of the Secretar\''s statement. I assure the Secretary that in 

 the course of time I will read and fully studv the excellent statement 

 that he has given. I am sure the chairman feels, as I feel, that the 

 totality of the environment and our legislative concern for it is the 

 principal concern of this committee. You, ]Mr. Secretary, I am sure 

 would agi'ee that the matter of preserving the ecolog^^ of the country 

 and the world and the environmental circumstances is a multidis- 

 ciplinary undertaldng. 



We must be concerned with estuarine pollution, with the oceanic 

 problem, fresh Avater streams within our country, the air envelope 

 that surrounds us, the natural and manmade lakes and all the aspects 

 of pollution as we have come to laiow it. And they must interrelate 

 one with the other. 



Any piece of legislation that we undeitake must take into account 

 the various disciplines and not just a single concern for a single area 

 of pollution. 



Would you not agree with that, Mr. Secretai-y ? 



Secretarv Hickel. Yes, I think that is rijrht. Senator. 



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