143 



Mr. Lennon. We think it is a series of steps. 



Dr. MacDonald. And I guess that is where we differ. 



We would hope to move a good long ways in this session of the Con- 

 gress, maybe this is not being politically realistic, but we are holding 

 to it. 



Mr. MosHER. Mr. Chairman, may I ask a question ? 



Mr. Lennon. Surely. 



Mr. Mosher. Dr. MacDonald, you are advocating a jump rather 

 than a step. You advocate a leap forward. 



Dr. MacDonald. Not in my present physical condition. 



Mr. Lennon. Doctor, we certainly appreciate your appearance. 



I am sure you know this committee on both sides is anxious to co- 

 operate in every way that we can. 



It has demonstrated this in bringing EPA into being, and in bring- 

 ing NOAA into being, and we, in turn, solicit the imderstanding on 

 your part. 



Does counsel have any questions or comment? 



Mr. Hetward. Dr. MacDonald, just for the record, I believe in con- 

 nection with Governor Lucey's position, is it not correct to say Gov- 

 ernor Lucey did indicate his support of the national land-use policy, 

 but in his statement also indicated that if there was any delay he would 

 support a coastal zone initiative ? 



Dr. ISIacDonald. That is correct. 



Mr. Heyward. Thank you very much. 



Mr. LenjSton. Thank you. Doctor. 



Dr. MacDonald. Mr. Chairman, I would like to thank you again 

 for this opportunity, and to personally salute you and the committee 

 for its great interest in matters that we consider most important. 



Mr. Lennon. Let me remind you, Doctor, that the Committee on 

 Oceanography instituted the ocean dumping hearings as a result of 

 a hangup on the part of the Army in not appealing the decision of 

 the AEC with respect to moving the 15 coffins of nerve gas out,_ and 

 then we got involved in it. As a result now this subcommittee, jointly 

 with the Subcommittee on Fisheries and Wildlife, is, in depth, trying 

 to relate EPA with the problems of the Corps of Engineers with re- 

 spect to the maintenance of harbors and waterways, et cetera, which 

 has been authorized and funded, and has to be kept to minimum depths 

 for navigation. 



You would not have an ocean dumping bill if it was not for this 

 committee, and we are involved in this thing, and we want youto rec- 

 ognize that we are not trying to obstruct what the administration has 

 way down the road some time in the future. 



We are trying to move and give it some help. I think we have dem- 

 onstrated that, sir. 



statement or dr. robert m. white, administrator, national oceanic 



AND atmospheric ASSOCIATION, DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE; ACCOM- 

 PANIED BY JAMES BRENNAN, OFFICE OF THE GENERAL COUNSEL, DEPART- 

 MENT OF COMMERCE ; AND DR. ROLAND SMITH, DEPUTY CHIEF, OCEANIC 

 DIVISION, OFFICE OF PLANS AND PROGRAMS, NOAA 



Dr. White. Yes, sir ; I do. 



Before I begin I would like to introduce my colleagues. On my left 

 is Mr. James Brennan, Office of the General Cfounsel, and on my rights 

 Dr. Roland Smith of tlie Oceanic Division. 



