EFFICIENCY IN THE OPERATION OF STEAMSHIPS. 127 
DISCUSSION. 
Mr. Ciirrorp D. Matiory, Associate:—There is little I can say at this time, as I have 
been away from shipping activities for nearlya month. I think that Captain Sullivan has 
covered the salient features very well indeed and, as he says, the most important factor out- 
side of the original cost of the property is the expense of operation. I might say that my ex- 
perience up to 1917 was in the coastwise trade, so I did not have the experience of com- 
peting with foreign tonnage. In 1917 I went with the United States Shipping Board, where 
I acted as assistant director of operations until the end of the war. Naturally, that experi- 
ence did not take economy into consideration. 
At the end of my career with the Shipping Board I associated myself with a gentleman 
who had much experience in Scotland. He was born in Glasgow and brought up in the tramp 
school there. We have been in business since the fall of 1919. Naturally, I believed the 
school I was brought up in, the American school, was as good as any. I am the fourth gen- 
eration in the shipping business, but when I became associated with Mr. Houston I found 
I had a great deal to learn. 
We are operating about twenty-three vessels on an intensive plan. By this I mean all 
details receive personal supervision, and the following up of cost is as carefully supervised as 
is possible for any organization to do. Whenever you consider the figures and examine the 
cost, the principal item which attracts attention and shows to our disadvantage is the matter 
of interest and depreciation charges. American shipowners cannot compete at high values, 
which we have to set up for American built tonnage, in comparison with the lower values of 
foreign built ships, excepting with outside aid. 
As to the details of operation, the question of fuel is one that requires a great deal of 
study. Exhaustive investigation of the proper purchase and use of fuel is essential, and 
with proper supervision of the fuel account I believe we can compete with anybody—that is, 
in oil burning. We are running a line to South Africa where coal is essential. We cannot 
carry enough oil for a round voyage and cannot buy oil out there at a price that would war- 
rant our burning oil. We get a cheap grade of coal at Durban, South Africa, but it is in- 
efficient. On the other hand, in the Mediterranean service we are burning oil on the round 
voyage. 
The Shipping Board is starting a movement that is very essential and will be very help- 
ful to those who will take advantage of the opportunity of gaining knowledge regarding the 
selection and proper use of fuel. The Shipping Board has instituted, at the Philadelphia 
Navy Yard, a course of instruction regarding the selection and use of fuel, which course 
should be of great practical value to all persons who are concerned with the uses of fuel oil 
on vessels. I have not been able, personally, to inspect their equipment, but I believe this 
is one of the important things that can be done to advance the operation of American ships. 
We have the advantage over our European competitors in having available large quantities 
of cheap fuel oil at our home ports. I have no doubt but what our navy knows more about the 
handling of oil fuel than any other navy, and the merchant marine should profit by that 
knowledge. The Shipping Board Committee will put it before those who are operating their 
ships in such a way that it will be very helpful. 
As to the cost of stevedoring, I do not know where Captain Sullivan got his figures, but 
