48 



operations. We are also prepared to recognize the extent of the problem as it has 

 been documented, and to focus on it where it is causing a problem for marine mam- 

 mal populations. Those problem areas are identifiable and we should hit them hard 

 with all the management, regulatory and enforcement measures at our disposal. 

 Where fishery interactions are not a problem, or where they have an insignificant 

 effect on marine mammal populations, or where they are not the real cause of popu- 

 lation declines or slowed recovery, why devise an elaborate system of rules and pen- 

 alties? The financial resources we have available for marine conservation are too 

 thin as it is. We cannot afford to squander them to fix something that "ain't broke." 



In conclusion, we believe it is time to move on to solving problems. We have 

 learned a lot from the interim Exemption you enacted five years ago. The size of 

 the problem appears to be more manageable than we knew five years ago: of the 

 40 populations of marine mammals that are subject to incidental mortality from 

 fishing operations, fishing caused mortality is significant for fewer than half, and 

 may not oe a factor for a half dozen others. This significant interaction occurs in 

 fewer than a dozen fisheries.^ We learned that where industry associations took the 

 initiative to educate and apply peer pressure to their members, registration and 

 self-reporting were far more successful than in fisheries where there was no such 

 effort. We learned that across-the-board log book requirements did not provide much 

 useful information without some additional means of verification. We learned that 

 the price of mandatory levels of observer coverage was beyond our fiscal capability. 

 We learned that intentional killing of marine mammals is a considerable source of 

 mortality in some fisheries. And also we learned that in seven of the twelve fisheries 

 with significant takes, the source of mortality was "deterrence". 



We urge you to consider the Joint Proposal because it builds upon what we've 

 learned about the problem of incidental taJce of marine mammals. In our view, this 

 approach will advance us from documentation of a problem to problem solving, and 

 will move the fishing industry from being part of the problem to being part of the 

 solution. 



Thank you again for this opportunity to testify. We look forward to working with 

 you as you continue your deliberations on the reauthorization of the MMPA. I will 

 De pleased to answer any questions from the Committee. 



Senator Kerry. Thank you very much, Ms. ludicello. 

 Mr. Thornburgh, I am going to try to balance the arguments 

 around here, so please proceed. 



STATEMENT OF GUY N. THORNBURGH, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, 

 PACIFIC STATES MARINE FISHERIES COMMISSION 



Mr. Thornburgh. Yes, sir, thank you. 



I am Guy Thornburgh, executive director of the Pacific States 

 Marine Fisheries Commission. 



More mammals are taken incidental to the fisheries along our 

 Pacific Coast than in the fisheries of either the Atlantic Coast or 

 all of Alaska. This certainly is not a boast on our part, but an indi- 

 cation of how important reauthorization of the Mammal Act is to 

 our Pacific Coast. 



It also happens to be a fact that most mammal populations of our 

 coast are not depressed. And after 20 years of MMPA, many fish- 

 eries are now actually negatively impacted bv abundant popu- 

 lations of mammals along our Pacific Coast. A balanced reauthor- 

 ization of MMPA is very important to us. We need to continue the 

 opportunity to catch the Nation's surplus of fish, while reducing 

 our take of marine mammals. And we also want to achieve some 



2 Alaska Prince William Sound Dria Gillnet; Alaska Bristol Bay Set and Dria Gillnet; Wash- 

 ington and Oregon Ijower Columbia River Region, Willipa Bay, Grays Harbor Drid Gillnet; 

 Washington Puget Sound Region and Inland Waters Salmon Set and Drift. Gillnet; California 

 Halibut and Angel Shark Set Gillnet; California Herring Purse Seine; Washington, Oregon, Cali- 

 fornia Salmon TroW, Alaska Southern Bering Sea and Aleutian Islands Sablensh Longline; Alas- 

 ka Prince William Sound Sablefish Longline; Washington and Oregon Salmon Net Pen; Gulf of 

 Maine Groundfish/Mackerel Sink Gillnet; Atlantic, Caribbean, and Gulf of Mexico Tuna, Shark, 

 and Swordfish Longline. 



