43 



all the way out to our boats to Montock, we had some extraor- 

 dinary numbers close to shore. The Barnegators were going on a 

 full day trip but they were doing half-day fishing quite a bit be- 

 cause they caught their quota too fast. 



Mr. Larson. It was almost all half day, the best summer ever. 



Mr. BOGAN. And it is not supposed to be that way. But what is 

 interesting is tell that to a scientist and they will tell you that 

 didn't happen, what you experienced did not happen because it 

 doesn't fit into a model. They are not trying to be these horrible 

 people toward us, they are just saying that it doesn't fit in the 

 model. 



Mr. Saxton. How far off do these large catches take place? 



Mr. BoGAN. The furthest offshore that we had persistent catches 

 was in the 26-mile range offshore — a place called Monsters Ledge — 

 where the fish could not be found if you did a trawl survey per- 

 formed during the day. 



Recall also please that the trawl surveys done in order to assess 

 stock status are done in the same place year after year. Bluefish 

 are a highly migratory international fish and these fish are pop- 

 ping up on the east side of the mud hole in a very big spread only 

 at night. We can only catch them at night. 



Our same boats, guys with 40 and 50 years of experience, can't 

 catch them during the day. Again, that is a factor and we can't ex- 

 plain that although that is consistent with the 1960's when we had 

 very bad recreational catches in the '60's. There was a dearth of 

 bluefish during the 1960's. 



Mr. FoTE. Yet if you were a surf fisher on Long Island Beach 

 State Park, you were in the desert last year, you didn't see a blue- 

 fish for most of the season. They basically have disappeared from 

 the surf fisherman and very bad catches in the Chesapeake Bay 

 and Barnegat Light. 



We were talking about history and what happened in 1945 and 

 one of our newest commissioners, the youngest one who is Stan 

 Blum who happens to be 81 years old, and Stan was a charter boat 

 captain in the 1930's and 1940's and then went into the service and 

 he said that bluefish disappeared all over the place in the 1940's 

 as Ray's chart is showing and then he hit the beaches in Azores 

 setting up a naval base and all of a sudden he found all the blue- 

 fish he wanted. He said, "Well, that is where the hell they went." 

 They do move all over the ocean. 



There have always been catches when you are shark fishing. 

 There have always been stocks offshore and guys when they are 

 counting your fish have always basically picked up bluefish over 

 the years. 



There is some kind of a decline in the stock. I am not going to 

 disagree with that and the surf fishermen have really felt the most 

 of it and the guys in the Chesapeake Bay and Barnegat Bay and 

 the guys in the Rarin Bay. Their catches of bluefish have dramati- 

 cally decreased and according to them, the stocks have crashed. 

 That might not be the case but according to them, that is how they 

 feel about it. 



Mr. Radonski. There is no doubt that you can have changes in 

 availability for good reasons. But I would hope that this committee, 

 before making their judgment on the value of science in this fish- 



