46 



If you, both Congressman Saxton and Congressman Pallone, had 

 not interceded and did what you did, NMFS would not have done 

 that peer review for school bluefin. As a result of the peer review, 

 again we were proven correct. I don't think it is going to be any 

 different with bluefish. 



If on bluefish we don't put the pressure and the money toward 

 that then NMFS will not take that action. But, the ultimate prob- 

 lem for NMFS that they attribute this to is that they don't have 

 the staff to incorporate the information that we give them once we 

 get it for them. 



Mr. Pallone. I don't know what the answer is today but that is 

 certainly something that we can look into, to make sure that there 

 is the follow-up and that something occurs. 



Mr. Saxton. Just on that point, Frank and I have co-sponsored 

 a bill that seems like it is far away from this subject but it really 

 is not far away at all. It would create an institution to delve into 

 some of these matters like we created in the 1940's to delve into 

 matters that had to do with human health. The National Institutes 

 for Health has come a long way in helping us understand science 

 about a lot of things that nobody knew at one time were even relat- 

 ed to human health. 



NMFS does research and NOAA does research and the EPA does 

 research. You name the organization and they do some kind of en- 

 vironmental research and yet one organization doesn't know what 

 the other is doing. 



So we think that it would be a good idea to have a National In- 

 stitute for the Environment where this information could be data 

 banked so that people would have access to every piece of informa- 

 tion that is known and then we can look at where the holes are 

 to begin to plug in studies and research activities to answer some 

 of the questions. 



We are looking today at bluefish which is a tiny little segment 

 of everything that we need to know about to properly manage fish- 

 eries. So anyway, that is my soap box. I have been talking about 

 that for six years, along with Frank, or more but I think it is a 

 good approach. I interrupted you, Tom, please go ahead. 



Mr. FOTE. I was going to say we have to get to the point where 

 we do ecosystem management. We have to include the whole envi- 

 ronment and that is what your bill will basically do, set up the 

 framework to do that. 



We ought to look at prey/predator relationships. For example, the 

 sand eel population has gone so bluefish don't come in shore. Strip- 

 ers are still coming in shore because they are more aggressive in 

 what they feed off, if you look, their bellies are all full of clams. 



You can't catch one on a plug because a plug would imitate a 

 sand eel. So you can give up plug fishing so the guys don't sell 

 lures anymore, jigs or anything else but they sell a hell of a lot of 

 clams because that is the bait the fish are feeding on and bluefish 

 can't adapt to feeding on those clams so they move further offshore. 

 That might be one of the reasons why you still get striped bass in 

 shore and bluefish offshore. 



Mr. Saxton. Thanks. I just bought a new plug pole, I just want 

 you to know. 



[Laughter.] 



