28 



Your question is, 1 think, what is the ratio of the take, foreign 

 againsl domestic, and porpoises killed, foreign and domestic. 



\)v. Fox. The take of yellowfin tuna and porpoise is lower relative 

 to the United States than the kill of porpoise by the foreign fleet 

 relative to the United States. We a— nine that the kill rates of the 

 foreign fleet in terms of the number of animals killed are roughly 2.5 

 times more than in the United States. 



There have been substantial reductions of United States kill since 

 1972. So that would lead to a higher proportion of the kill than one 

 would expect by looking at the proportions of the catch of yellowfin 

 tuna. 



The Chairman. Then they catch a third as much as we do, but are 

 twice as inefficient. It would seem, then, that their take of porpoises 

 would be considerably higher than the normal number that you talked 

 about. 



Mr. Pollock. May w t e answ-er for the record ? 



The Chairman. If you would provide these numbers and calcula- 

 tions for us, that would be helpful. 



[The following information was provided in response to the fore- 

 going :] 



Relationship between U.S. and non-U.S. catch of yellowfin tuna and porpoise 

 mortality in the Eastern Tropical Pacific Ocean — 1975. 



Yellowfin tuna associated with porpoise: Percent 



United States 85. 4 



Non-United States 14. 6 



Estimated porpoise mortality incidental to yellowfin fishing: Percent 



United States 75. 2 



Non-United States 24. 8 



Sources: Table 1 , Page 106 Progress of Research on Porpoise Mortality, Fiscal Year 1976. September 7, 1976. 

 Table 4, Page 6-9, Report of Workshop on Stock Assessment of Porpoises, September, 1976. 



Mr. Oberstar. It would seem to me that these numbers are highly 

 speculative. They are under no obligation to report. There is no com- 

 pulsion on the part of their government, whereas in the United States 

 enforcement is obvious. Committee hearings have highlighted this. 



Publicity in the news has put pressure on the industry, and they 

 are doing an honest job of reporting. 



On page seven, Mr. Pollock, of your testimony today, "you may 

 come to a situation where we will be forced to consider legislation 

 designed to minimize some of the obvious conflicts." 



What kind of legislation, what subject area would you suggest, and 

 what action do you recommend the committee to take as a result of 

 these hearings ? 



Mr. Pollock. Mr. Oberstar, I have a problem that is not dictated 

 by the court order at all, but we are in the process w T ithin the admin- 

 istration to resolve some of the difficulties on the way we approach 

 this. 



Our National Marine Fisheries Service has some ideas, NOAA 

 has some ideas, and other people have taken a look at this. We have 

 not formulated a policy within the administration, and hope to do so 

 very soon. 



Mr. Oberstar. Does this rethinking process include reconsideration 

 of the goals of the 1972 act, or maybe of 30 ? 



