83 



We think that condition should be corrected and we also believe 

 that the permit procedures are such that I think they are ridiculously 

 long. 



I don't think they are necessary. 



I think the Secretary or the Administrator under section 111 had 

 a goal that was realistic for him for 2 years and that was to basically 

 reduce porpoise mortality to the lowest practical level. 



Mr. Oberstar. Is there any change you would recommend in the 

 law, that it be changed to the lowest practical level? 



Mr. Felaxdo. Yes. 



Mr. Oberstar. Rather than levels approaching zero mortality? 



Mr. Felaxdo. Yes, based on the interpretation of Judge Eichey in 

 May 1976, even when the regulations are promulgated and a permit 

 is issued, a U.S.-flag fishing vessel is right now prohibited from fish- 

 ing tuna associated with porpoise beyond the Eastern Tropical 

 Pacific. 



There is evidence of tuna associated with porpoise in the Central 

 and Western Pacific. 



There has been information that this is also true in the Atlantic 

 and also in the Indian Ocean, but under Judge Eichey's interpreta- 

 tion, and now presently agreed upon by the Circuit Court, and the 

 way the agency is administering the act. we cannot develop any new 

 areas outside the Eastern Pacific. 



That is a tremendous detriment to have any U.S.-flag vessel in 

 this fishery. 



Mr. Oberstar. Let me ask each one of the captains this question. 



In your judgment and fishing experience, is the basic requirement 

 of the law an attainable one, to achieve levels of mortality approach- 

 ing zero? 



Mr. Silva. If this is going to be a true possibility, it is difficult for 

 me to say at this time. 



I think we can probably some day get very close to this, but it is 

 not happening today. 



In looking back at all the improvements that we have done in 

 porpoise rescue, none of these things happen overnight. 



You know, if there are people here that think we have a magic 

 wand, do we not. 



We have worked toward the type net Captain Jorge used. 



We didn't develop that overnight. We had people go up to Seattle 

 and he spent a lot of months there. 



Mr. Oberstar. Do you think you are approaching zero mortality 

 in the work that you are undertaking? 



Captain Silva. I think that each time we meet a record we are 

 approaching zero. I don't want to sound smart. We are talking 

 about several thousands of porpoise that do get lost and if each time 

 we are reducing that, if we are reducing the percentage, then Ave are 

 approaching that area, but if we are called upon for meeting that 

 week after week thing, saying, hey, you are not doing this, you are 

 merciless and you are doing things needlessly and you are a wanton 

 killer, then that doesn't make sense to us. 



It is pretty degrading. 



