87 



nological breakthroughs, tlie super apron, and the 114-inch-mesh 

 webbing. 



How pervasive is it ? 



How many of the fleets that we have are capable of this? 



Mr. Felando. I have all kinds of experts. 



Captain Jorge, who has operated the Elizabeth CJ. is here. 



I believe of the 96 very large vessels, at least in October before the 

 administrative law judge, the testimony was that 01 of the 00 ves- 

 sels purchased sufficient small mesh or fine mesh, the type that is 

 required to have the two panels on the super apron, and they are 

 awaiting orders. 



That was done. 



We made that commitment before the proposed regulations came 

 out and that was because during 1076 we conducted a 20 vessel ex- 

 periment of what we call the bold contender system. 



And the bold contender system in 1075 came back home with very 

 good results, but the captain of the vessel did not know whether 

 this was due to what Ave call two panels plus an apron, or just two 

 panels of fine mesh, so with the assistance of the government or the, 

 Porpoise Rescue Foundation. 20 vessels conducted an experiment 

 in 1076, 10 vessels with just two panels of fine mesh and 2 vessels 

 with the entire bold contender system. 



The Elisabeth C.J. was one of those vessels that conducted an 

 experiment and it did have an observer on the trip prior to the one 

 that that cruise report is based upon. 



At that time the results were very good on the cruise but there 

 were defects in the system and suggestions for changes were made. 



"What I am telling you is basically the system of the bold con- 

 tender was evolved out of prior experiments in 1074-75 ; that based 

 primarily on the reports that came out of the bold contender system 

 and now the Elizabeth C.J. cruise, regardless of whether the regula- 

 tions required it or not. I believe our fleet, the larger vessels, the new 

 vessels in excess of 600 tons or so will be equipped with that mesh. 



Xow. I have given you a long answer. 



However. I would like to have Captain Jorge speak on that and 

 I would like to have Franklin Alverson provide you with more 

 information if you desire. 



Mr. Alversox. First of all, you mentioned 213 vessels. 



What we are talking about here are purse seiners and in 1076 

 there were approximately 124 vessels that took certificates of inclu- 

 sion to fish for yellowfin in association with porpoise. 



So we are talking about 124 vessels. 



Mr. Bonior. What do you mean in association with porpoise? 



I am not as familiar as I shoulda be. 



I have seen that term used and often. 



Mr. Alversox. Basically, we are fishing for yellowfin and skip- 

 jack in the tropical oceans. 



Skipjacks are rarely found. Yellowfin are found with porpoise, 

 which we would call associated fish, or as school fish. 



The regulations state that if you intend to catch any fish in asso- 

 ciation with mammals, you have to have a certificate of inclusion, and 



