35 



Mr. J. Thomas. But in looking at that, there is very modem 

 equipment. They are, in that statement, probably concerned about 

 soil compaction. We have some equipment — or we do not, but 

 equipment exists now that can do this sort of work with minimal 

 disturbance and very low pressure, very low risk of compaction, 

 which would probably be considerably more efficient. 



But again, that is another prescriptive statement. Wait a minute, 

 tell us what the intent is. If you intend to pass legislation, tell us 

 the intent. Tell us the desired future condition. Let us figure out 

 how to get there most effectively and efficiently, which will change 

 over time. Five years ago, we did not have that kind of equipment. 

 We have some now that, I suspect, puts less pounds per square foot 

 on the ground from the wheels than from a horse's hoof. 



Mr. POMBO. I have one other question that maybe you can clar- 

 ify. In a previous statement, it was said that in a 1989 Audubon 

 Society study, there were only 41,000 acres of thickly wooded, old- 

 growth forest left in the United States and that there are even 

 fewer acres now, and only 10 percent of them are protected in wil- 

 derness areas. Would you care to comment on that? 



Mr. J. Thomas. Somebody, I think, made a mistake in transcrib- 

 ing numbers. Those people do some pretty good studies, but there 

 are millions of acres of old growth, not 40,000. Something is wrong 

 with the statement. I don't know what it is. 



Mr. POMBO. Unfortunately, I don't have a copy of the report here; 

 I just have a copy of the statement that was made, and if you 

 would care to clear that up for the record 



Mr. J. Thomas. I would just say I do not think that statement 

 is accurate, but I have dealt with those folks, and I think somebody 

 made a transcription error or something, but that is grotesquely 

 wrong. We are talking about old-growth forests in general. 



Mr. POMBO. All right. Thank you. 



Mr. Brown. Mr. Thomas, I think I do not need to tell you that 

 I have the highest respect and regard for your capabilities, your 

 vast knowledge of this subject, and of your desire to faithfully carry 

 out the best possible management practices even when you are con- 

 fused by some of the legislation that we adopt here. I think you 

 will, nevertheless, do your best to overcome that. 



In response to a direct question from Mr. Lewis, you indicated 

 that the bill would negate the provisions of the negotiated settle- 

 ment that was entered into in 1989 and 1990. Is that what you 

 meant to say? 



Mr. J. Thomas. I said it would replace it. 



Mr. Brown. You said what? 



Mr. J. Thomas. I said, once you have legislation, you must com- 

 ply with the legislation, regardless of what went before. 



Mr. Brown. The legislation, on page 16, beginning with line 19, 

 says that you will implement the regeneration plan required by the 

 stipulation for entry of judgment, basically the negotiated agree- 

 ment. 



To the degree that you indicated that this bill would either ne- 

 gate it or would replace it, that would seem to be contradicted by 

 this statement. 



Mr. J. Thomas. I would say that that particular part of it is, but 

 there are other aspects of it in terms of burning and trails. The 



