90 



Mr. POMBO. Under the current management agreement that was 

 agreed upon and signed by 19 or 18 different groups, were the 

 cattlemen part of that agreement? 



Mr. Shannon. Yes, we were. 



Mr. POMBO. Did you get everything you wanted in that agree- 

 ment? 



Mr. Shannon. It was not what we wanted. It was what we did 

 not have to give up. 



Mr. PoMBO. But you still abide by the agreement that you 

 signed? 



Mr. Shannon. Yes. We have some major problems in California 

 on grazing that you may or may not be aware of Anjrway, there 

 has been a lawsuit filed on the Sierra Forest, which is up out of 

 Fresno. 



And it has the potential to shut down grazing in all of California, 

 if it prevails or if it is traded off wrong, because of the lack of 

 NEPA documentation that has been done by the Forest Service. 



And probably the reason it has not been done, the Forest Service 

 estimates are $50,000 to $60,000 for the NEPA documentation, per 

 permit — or per log, excuse me. There are 55 permittees on the Se- 

 quoia, and there are 75 or so allotments. 



I am not sure of the numbers throughout California, but you £ire 

 talking about a lot of money. And the money is not there in the 

 budget to do the NEPA documentation, as required — as has been 

 interpreted by the courts to be required. 



Mr. PoMBO. Mr. Duysen, you said that you are currently import- 

 ing logs to run through your mill now? 



Mr. Duysen. That is correct, Congressman. 



Mr. POMBO. And you can do that economically? 



Mr. Duysen. The economics are very marginal, at best. But right 

 now, we are attempting to try to keep the doors open and keep our 

 people employed. And, yes, it is very marginal, but it looks like 

 probably one of the few opportunities we are going to have in the 

 near future. 



Mr. POMBO. And those logs are coming from where? 



Mr. Duysen. From New Zealand. 



Mr. POMBO. From New Zealand? 



Mr. Duysen. Yes, radiata pine, which is basically monterey pine 

 that we see on our west coast; only, through a very unique climate 

 in New Zealand, they are able to grow those trees very fast. 



Mr. PoMBO. Do they follow the same kind of management tech- 

 niques that we practice in this country? 



Mr. Duysen. Basically, what they have done in New Zealand is 

 replace a good portion of their native hardwood tropical forest with 

 radiata pine, and it's plantation forestry — a little bit different in its 

 wholescale plantation forestry, a little bit different than what we 

 see in our national forest. 



Mr. PoMBO. How long do you suspect that you will be able to 

 maintain importing logs and still keep the mill open? 



Mr. Duysen. Well, at this point, we are still in the experimental 

 stage. I don't think we will ever be able to afford to substitute 

 American logs with foreign logs, 100 percent. 



I guess time will tell over the next few months, the next 6 

 months, how well this project is going to work out. But because of 



