191 



Mr. McKerxax. If that bill passed and was signed by the Presi- 

 dent, why then the United States would certainly have to reconsider 

 its position at that particular conference. 



Mr. Kyros. If the bill which you seem to approve passed, namely 

 H.R. 10420, which calls for certain controls and might include pe- 

 riods of moratorium, would that not require you to change your posi- 

 tion on the agenda for this Conference ( 



Mr. McKerxax. Well, as I understand the bill, and particularly 

 the amendments that have been suggested by the Department of Com- 

 merce, this would remain to be resolved ; that is, there would be con- 

 siderable jflexibility as was brought out this morning, and in addition 

 there would be the commission that would study the many aspects 

 of marine mammal exploitation and conservation. 



There is a possibility that the Government would want to change 

 its position, but I do not believe that it would necessarily be manda- 

 tor}' that we do so. 



Mr. Ktros. On page 6 you say, "to the best of our knowledge," 

 that is the State Department I assume, scientific evidence is not avail- 

 able to support a blanket prohibition in the killing of all species of 

 ocean mammals, or even all species of seals." 



"\^Tien you say "in your judgment," do you mean the judgment of 

 Interior Department or of somebody else ? 



The State Department does not make an independent judgment on 

 the killing of ocean mammals, does it ? 



Mr. McKerxax. Well. no. I was calling upon the scientific evidence 

 that is available, and from the scientists of the international commis- 

 sions that we have been talking about here, scientists of the Fur Seal 

 Commission, for example. 



There is a good example where a point was raised this morning with 

 regard to sea otters, and I think this is another example of a popula- 

 tion where, at least as I imderst-and it, in some areas the population is 

 declining because of the declining food. 



The sea otter overpopulated some of the islands of the Aleutians. 

 I have personal knowledge of the scientific evidence available on these 

 animals, and so this is a judgment on our part, based upon the best 

 available scientific evidence. 



Mr, Ktros. Well, I thought the testimony to date questioned the 

 validity of the scientific data collected on the herd. 



Mr. 'McI^JERXAX. It is true with ceitain species. Xo question about 

 that. 



What I said is that the scientific evidence does not support a blanket 

 proliibition on the killing of ocean mammals, or some species of seals. 



^Lr. Kyros. In that case on what species should there be a ban ? 



Mr. McKerxax. Well, I am not fully familiar perhaps with all of 

 the species of seals or stock of seals around the world, but let me say 

 that with respect to the monk seal of Hawaii I would certainly believe 

 there should be a ban on killing those seals. 



There is no particular purpose served in the killing of many of the 

 harbor seals, small stocks of local harbor seals. On the other hand the 

 Pribilof fur seals obviously can stand harvesting. 



To the best of my knowledge the hood and harp seals of the 

 Canadian Subarctic can stand a harvest, although by the way, there 

 has been too great a harvest of these animals, but the scientists of the 



