41 



out these changes. That is why we are here. We have no place else 

 to go. 



Congress is the one that interfered with our contract, not us. The 

 Forest Service and us had agreements. We made contracts. We 

 made changes. We did this all along and it was only Congress that 

 came in and made that change. 



Mr. Miller. The bottom line, then, is that you cannot do busi- 

 ness unless we give you 1951 prices 23 years from now? 



Mr. Lewis. That is what you say 1951. I will go back and say 

 the Forest Service can make that $50 or $100. 



Mr. Miller. And there was an end to that contract. 



Mr. Lewis. But they can go back and make that rate. They can 

 make whatever rate they want. It is not a '54 contract. Those 

 changes — we made, I don't know, 20 changes or something like that 

 to the life of that contract. George Leonard was one that we used 

 to go in and negotiate changes. And he was a tough negotiator. He 

 would sit in there and say we need this and this and this changed 

 and we would sit down and negotiate those changes. We need to 

 meet NFDA. We would go down and meet those. We would make 

 those changes all along. 



Somewhere along the line this thing got blown out of hand. We 

 were told we never did this. We were told that all these things 

 didn't happen. And all of a sudden, the next thing that you knew, 

 we were in trouble. And we are back here asking for help. That is 

 exactly what we are doing, because we need it. We have got our 

 backs against the wall. And I want the people to work. I want them 

 to have jobs and I want it to continue. That is my town. I have 

 been there 30 years. My family were born and raised there. That 

 is all we are trying to do. We are not trying to get any sweetheart 

 deal. We are not trying to cut a deal or anything. We are trying 

 to survive. 



Mr. Miller. Well, I just — ^you know, it is like all the discussion 

 earlier in the panel about what a wonderful environmental record 

 you have, except, well, you know, the expenditures pursuant to con- 

 sent decrees and guilty pleas. Let us just understand something 

 here, that the question originally arose because people found, as I 

 said, the contract unacceptable. And we made those changes. You 

 can litigate those changes, but if what you are telling me is that 

 this is the only place that there is relief is to go back to those forest 

 practices and to go back to those prices, that that is the only place 

 there is relief, then the question may be whether or not you just 

 play this contract out in 2004. I mean, I don't understand that, but 

 I guess that is the case. 



This is important to the town. This is important to everyone else 

 who can stand around with their hands in their pockets saying 

 what is the Federal Government going to do. 



Mr. Lewis. I am saying we are not going to make it to 2004 

 under the contract changes you made. We are not even going to 

 make it. We are not going to make it there. That is why we are 

 here. We are not going to make it. 



The Chairman. You know, and I might say to the gentleman 

 from California, Ketchikan is doing everything in its power so that 

 they can divest and get this $25 million they get a substantial 

 economy, but they can't — there is nothing they can do until the 



