want to, and, oh, by the way, your payment is now $1500 per 

 month not $900 a month? What would you think if the government 

 said tough luck if you do not like it, we are changing our contract 

 to say that we can call your loan at any moment, even if you make 

 all of your payments on time? What would you think? Is that fair? 

 Would that help you plan for your family's future? Would that give 

 you security? 



Well, that is exactly what the Federal Government, this commit- 

 tee, did to the Ketchikan Pulp Corporation. It is unfair and it is 

 unjust. And under the U.S. Supreme Court doctrine, it is illegal for 

 the government to change a contract without paying for damages 

 caused by the breach. This type of action is precisely why the Unit- 

 ed States Congress and the Federal Department of Agriculture 

 should not be making the decision on extending the KPC contract. 

 The State of Alaska should do it, be here we are again airing this 

 issue in the Federal arena. 



My other Tongass bill would give the State the power to control 

 the Tongass, but we will talk about that bill another day in this 

 committee. 



I want to stress one thing. If Ketchikan Pulp decides not to rein- 

 vest and shuts down their mill and will go to court and is in court 

 now, and receives a payment, it is in the billions of dollars, dollars 

 the taxpayers will pay, but it doesn't help the city of Ketchikan. It 

 doesn't help the working families that reside in Ketchikan because 

 it did not help them in Sitka. It will kill the industry. There will 

 be no more logging in Southeast Alaska. 



And those that would like that, at least I wish they would be 

 honest about it. At least the Sierra Club is honest. They don't want 

 any more trees cut on the national forest and they have said that. 

 They have finally come to the front and said what they want. Let 

 us not play the charade that we are for a timber industry but we 

 don't like this con. We are for added value, but we don't like pulp, 

 the highest added-value product we have in the Tongass. 



I think it is very important that my colleagues, even to have the 

 problem we have today in the Tongass. Mr. Miller and I have sat 

 through this, I don't know how many years. Mr. Miller has made 

 comments to me, as I said — you were not here, Mr. Miller, about 

 not losing any jobs, about not having any mills shut down, about 

 not having deletion of the timber supply. Yet the Forest Service 

 keeps cutting back, back and back to where the mill no longer is 

 a viable industry. 



In an area where I flew the other day 45 minutes out of the city 

 of Sitka on my way to Ketchikan, all I saw was 45 standing min- 

 utes of flying at 105 miles an hour of dead trees, just dead trees. 

 No live trees, dead trees. People forget that is what we want the 

 pulp mill to do. People forget that is what we were told we would 

 have an industry in 1989 and 1990. Both times people have said 

 that. In fact, they have lied to us. 



The gentleman from South Dakota. 



STATEMENT OF HON. TIM JOHNSON, A U.S. REPRESENTATIVE 

 FROM SOUTH DAKOTA 



Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I simply have a state- 

 ment that I would to submit for the record. And I suspect that the 



