260 



There is concern over the ability to manage the forests but we 

 know that we have private and native lands which I believe have 

 to meet state regulations and then we have National Forests, 

 which is under the Forest Service. Could you comment in your pro- 

 fessional opinion on the adequacy of the State to manage and over- 

 see its responsibility on private lands for logging practices in a 

 manner in which is compatible, say with the Forest Service and I 

 take advantage of you because there are three professional forests 

 available that random select. 



Mr. Begalka. Well, as you know right now the state is involved 

 in a renewal, a revision of the state's Forest Practices Act. Prob- 

 ably the most significant difference I can see and offhand would be 

 the size of the clearcuts. In the private timber the natives are al- 

 lowed to harvest all the wood. 



The other problem that I could see is the fact that the state is 

 quite understaffed in their regulation personnel. They can get out, 

 they have two forces at Ketchikan who regulate the State Forest 

 Practices; the Forest Service on the other hand has a tremendous 

 number of machines and biologists that — they do very well to com- 

 plete. 



Senator Wirth. What I am getting at and I think 



Senator Murkowski. What I am getting at and I want the Chair- 

 man to understand the differentials because, we paint with a broad 

 brush accusations such as poor forest Management practices and 

 logging too close to creeks, erosion and so forth. I am wondering if 

 in some cases we are confusing and not making a distinction be- 

 tween what is happening on the private land or as you indicated 

 that there is a limitation of that state access to oversee us and the 

 fact that they can log much larger areas and that the control is 

 much stricter on federal lands than it is on the private lands and 

 that we see inconsistencies and we see more of them on private 

 lands than public lands or not. 



Mr. Begalka. Well I do not really think — I think that the con- 

 trol is adequate and no matter what the state says — I work for the 

 natives sometimes too and I discovered the forest practices they in- 

 voked were as good as — they had the fence put up but it is a little 

 difficult to assess when you can take an entire valley and clearcut 

 it in a single 80-acre unit and I see no adverse problems either 

 way. 



Senator Wirth. We thank you all very much. Mr. Begalka and 

 we thank you for your professional views. 



Now if we might move to the next panel, Mr. John Blubaum, 

 Roger Arriola, David Bray, Steve Connelly, Brad Finney and 

 Robert Elliot. Perhaps moving up we might get our next six speak- 

 ers, Eric Hummel, Paul Dirksen, John Clifton, Laurin Boyer, Virgil 

 Gile and Tam Murphy. 



Let us begin with this group, you are all familiar with the rules 

 of the committee and the constraint of time. The red light will go 

 on at the end of two minutes and as you know I will just be forced 

 to cut you off at that point and not being rude, only trying to re- 

 spect everybody else and get to them. 



Mr. Blubaum. 



