315 



Washington and disposition was made there through some kind of 

 a computer drawing of some nature. I had no participation in that. 



Senator Wirth. I am informing my staff that the drawing was 

 made, the list was submitted after the time of closure for submis- 

 sion and some were able to submit lists — knew about submitting 

 lists and other people did not know the lists would be submitted 

 and it is in that area that there might be some area of misunder- 

 standing or some people feeling that they got had or did not get 

 had and that is, I think, nothing that — and any of us had any idea 

 was going to happen. I will tell you Senator Murkowski and I must 

 have talked a dozen times about the procedure, what would be fair 

 way for submitting lists and the one variable we did not think 

 about. I think we thought about just about every other one, as to 

 what would happen and what did not happen and as one knows, it 

 is sort of like water, water always seeps down and looks for the 

 hole, looks for the opening, right, and just you found the opening 

 and slipped right in there and obviously caused a significant prob- 

 lem and I think I can assure you that the next time Senator Mur- 

 kowski and I do hearings together we will have a very clear policy 

 on lists. 



Senator Murkowski. There is no doubt about that. 



Senator Wirth. Enough said about that, we appreciate you all 

 being here and everyone is operating in a good way and responsible 

 and that is extraordinary, I think. Senator Murkowski. In many 

 ways only in America would you have people feeling so strongly, 

 sitting next to each other, in total disagreement from one witness 

 to the next, only in America would you have an employer and em- 

 ployee come in and say that the policy of that person's employer 

 was fundamentally wrong and many of us disagreed with him even 

 though the employer pays that individual's salary. No matter how 

 this comes out I think this is, in my opinion, quite remarkable tes- 

 timony to how democracy ought to work and while I have heard 

 that this hearing was set up in some way and have not allowed de- 

 mocracy to work then I apologize for that. As Frank says we did 

 the best we can and as to the lists we did not anticipate this. 



If there are no other comments on the subject, let us go on and 

 we thank you all very much for joining us. Thank you for being 

 here. 



The next panel, Mr. Jim Byron, Gary Robinson, Pauline Green, 

 Tom Winter, J.C. MacMillan and Richard Burrell and if we could 

 move into the on-deck circle we will have Don Harbour, Viril So- 

 derberg, Perry Apostolis, Jan Paulson and Dan Lindgren and Alan 

 Monk. 



Thank you all for being here. May we get started with Mr. 

 Byron? 



STATEMENT OF JAMES BYRON 



Mr. Byron. Thank you. 



Senator Murkowski. I admire those red suspenders. You must be 

 a logger. 



Mr. Byron. I am a logger. I represent a large logging and cutting 

 operation. We have four different distinct spheres of cutting that 

 we work in. Half of our cutting is in private timber, native lands, 



