484 



Senator Murkowski. I do not know where, when the final deci- 

 sion came down that went into the final offer to Shee Atika, came 

 from, whether it came from unelected parties or elected parties. 



Senator Wirth. It sounds to me like the great opportunity got 

 missed to save a lot of land, is that right? 



Mr. Senna. If they had offered an adequate exchange, we would 

 have been very, very glad to exchange. But the point is the consid- 

 eration that was offered fell way short of the mark, and in justifi- 

 cation to our shareholders, we could not accept such an exchange 

 as was finally offered. 



Senator Wirth. And the argument is made that that offer was 

 very low because the people making that offer thought you all were 

 desperate enough that you would have to accept that offer, is that 

 correct? 



Mr. Senna. I am speculating that that is the way that they were 

 viewing the situation. 



Senator Wirth. And "they" being whom? 



Mr. Senna. Now, I think the primary driving force was the envi- 

 ronmental groups. 



Senator Wirth. The environmental groups did not own any of 

 this land. They cannot make an offer, can they? The Forest Service 

 and the U.S. Government are the only people that own the land. 

 Did the U.S. Government make an offer to you that fell far short? 



Mr. Senna. Yes, in the final proposal it did fall short. 



Senator Wirth. It was the Forest Service offer that fell short, is 

 that right? 



Mr. Senna. Well, I do not think it was the Forest Service. 



Senator Wirth. Who else can make an offer? 



Mr. Senna. Well, it was proposed in the act of Congress. 



Senator Murkowski. Mr. Chairman, I would assume we have got 

 a feel for it as a consequence of the hearing yesterday and today. 

 There is no excess land that somebody does not have a classifica- 

 tion on for the Tongass. That is the difficulty. You can go designate 

 land for an exchange, but it is somebody else's land, either the 

 Forest Service's which is already in a sale or proposed to be in a 

 sale, or it is a wilderness or a designated area of non timber cut- 

 ting. There is simply no land. 



So, what you have to do is you have to get the parties together 

 for an exchange. Now, the land that was proposed in sale, obvious- 

 ly there is an objection to that land going into the trade because 

 what are they getting in return? They are giving up. Trade implies 

 give and take, and we could not identify among the interested par- 

 ties a reasonable give and take. That was unfortunate. We could 

 not get the Federal money to just buy their position out. It was not 

 possible, and they knew it. And we tried, Don Young and I both 

 tried. There was an effort to try and get the Forest Service to give 

 up land, but that land was in sales or proposed sales. So, it was 

 objected to by various industry groups. 



What we had hoped to do was try and identify value for value. 

 We wanted to put this in wilderness with the rest of the million 

 acres on Admiralty Island, and it just makes good sense, Mr. Chair- 

 man, to take another area of wilderness contingent to Admiralty 

 that was less desirable, because all wilderness areas have a priori- 



