508 



Mr. Chairman, an extraordinary thing struck me, if you look at 

 the cut over the last decade, you see, as the witnesses have indicat- 

 ed, that the terminology the Forest Service is mandated to make 

 available each year, you see that the actual cut is much less, and 

 so what that means is there should be an excess unused that was 

 available and credited each year. For instance, in 1978 they cut 

 414. Well, they should have 23 excess, and then in 1979 another 20, 

 another 10 in 1980, in 1981 they cut 387. Well, that should have 

 given them 110,000 more than they needed. 



By the time you get through with this whole thing, in 10 years 

 you find there was 750 million board feet short of what they were 

 required to make available. So, there are some funny games going 

 on. I wish we had a Forest Service witness here, because if they are 

 required to put this up and make it available, and that implies 

 roading, and have done this and the timber is available. But if the 

 industry has not cut it what has happened to it? Over 10 years, you 

 find that they have cut, instead of 4.5, 3.7. You wonder if they need 

 a budget at all. 



Senator Wirth. That is a good point. 



[Applause.] 



Senator Wirth. They released a lot of timber that would have 

 been traded for the previously discussed area on Admiralty. 



Gentlemen, I want to thank you very much for being here. I am 

 struck by a final comment that juvenile fish need places to hide. 

 When talking about members of the Senate, we all need places to 

 hide. We thank you all very much for being here. It was very, very 

 good testimony. 



The fifth panel, as we move along, will be Robert Tonkin, of the 

 Territorial Sportsmen, Robert Ward of the Sitka Convention and 

 Visitors Bureau, Les Cronk, Southeast Stevedoring, and Ken Leg- 

 horn, Tongass Tourism and Recreation Business Association. 



We are going to take a break now. I have just been reminded by 

 the court reporter that it would be a good idea to get sustenance in 

 our systems and so why do not we do that. It is now 1:00 o'clock 

 and let us shoot for 1:25; can we do that? 



[Recess taken.] 



Senator Wirth. We are back on the record at 1:25. We ask the 

 witnesses to again join us at the witness table. 



Gentlemen, thank you, for being with us. 



The witnesses on the Fifth Panel this afternoon are Mr. Robert 

 Tonkin, of the Territorial Sportsmen; Mr. Robert Ward, of the 

 Sitka Convention and Visitors Bureau; Mr. Les Cronk, Southeast 

 Stevedoring; and Mr. Ken Leghorn, Tongass Tourism and Recrea- 

 tion Business Association. 



Why do not we start with you, Mr. Tonkin, and we will just move 

 through. You are familiar with the procedures of the committee. 



STATEMENT OF ROBERT TONKIN, TERRITORIAL SPORTSMEN 



Mr. Tonkin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 



Mr. Chairman and members of the Subcommittee, the Territorial 

 Sportsmen is a conservation organization with interests in sports, 

 fishing, hunting and wise use of natural resources. 



