SELECT COMMITTEE ON THE SEA FISHERIES BILL. 



135 



17 March 1904.] 



Mr. LovELL. 



[Contimued. 



Chairman — continued. 



2378. Have you been accustomed to be able 

 to get larger fish in former years ? — Yes. 



2379. And you find it increasingly difficult to 

 •do so now? — Yes. 



2380. You consider that this last year has 

 been as bad as any year? — Every year gets 

 ■worse. 



2381. Have you seen the proposal in the Bill 

 to prevent the landing of undersized flat fish 

 from the eastern grounds, which I understand 

 are the main sources of supply ? — Yes. 



2382. Would you, as a retail dealer in under- 

 .■sized flat fish, approve of that ? — Certainly. 



2383. In the nope that the result would be 

 that larger fish would be caught in the future ? 

 — Certainh'. We had a splendid illustration of 

 that at tlie time of the last Grimsby strike. 

 When it was ended we had one of the finest lots 

 of plaice we had had for many a year. 



2384. Owing to the vessels being laid up for 

 months which mostly caught the smaller fish ? 

 —That is it. 



Dulce of Ahercom. 



2385. What class of people do you supply 

 with your fried fish ? — Chiefly among the poorer 

 ■classes who have no means of cooking it them- 

 selves. 



2386. Then this diminution in the supply of 

 flat fish must be a great loss to them ? — Cer- 

 tainly. 



2387. And also if you had a superior class of 

 fish with regard to size it would be an equal 

 benefit to them, because they could buy those 

 fish at a cheaper rate than they now do the 

 smaller ones ? — Yes. 



2388. And they would have a larger amount 

 of food for consumption ? — That is so. 



2389. Therefore you consider that this diminu- 

 tion of plaice and flat fish really affects the pub- 

 lic very much ? — Very much indeed. We got 

 np a petition in 1890, and these were the terms 

 of that petition got up by our trade. " This is 

 the petition of the London Fried Fish trade, 

 a,nd the trade in general. That we the under- 

 signed members of the above trades humbly beg 

 of thee to take into consideration a great and 

 serious grievance that is existing in our trades. 

 That that grievance is the catching and selling 

 of immature fish, especially flat fish. That not 

 only is the catching of the above fish a wilful and 

 wanton waste of human food, but a destruction 

 of the fishing grounds and the ruination of 

 our trade. That we are of opinion that an Act 

 of Parliament should be passed making it illegal 

 to catch or sell immature fish. That trawl fish 

 such as plaice, sand dabs, &c., &c., should not 

 measure less than 12 inches from the tip of the 

 nose to the end of the tail. That if this grievance 

 is not speedily stopped it will mean an extinction 

 of a trade that supplies a necessary article 

 of food to more than half the population of 

 London, especially the poorer classes." And we 

 have been going on ever since, endeavouring to 

 do something to get it done. 



2390. Do you have individual complaints 

 from your customers with regard to the supply 

 of this class of fish and the high price ? — Yes. 

 You see they do not care for other kinds of fish. 



Duke of Ahercom — continued. 



although we have to use them. Fortunately, 

 these last few years other fish have sprung up, 

 but they do not like them; if we do not get 

 plaice our trade falls off" 25 per cent. 



2391. And what apphes to you, I suppose, 

 applies to the 2,000 others engaged in the same 

 trade in London ?— Yes. 



2392. Perhaps it is not right to ask you this, 

 but do you ever deal in dog fish ? — Yes, 1 

 can give you the statistics of the last two 

 months of the kinds of fish I have had to fry — 

 not that I want them or the public want them 

 — but I have had to fry them. Take January 

 and February this year. On January 1st we 

 had megrims — I suppose you know what they 

 are. On the 2nd of January, turbots — they 

 happened to come my way rather reasonably. 

 On the 4th, turbots and brills ; 5th, turbots and 

 brills; 6th, plaice; 7th, turbots; 8th, 9th, 11th 

 and 12th, dog fi.sh ; 13th, 14th and 15th, 

 haddocks; 16th, plaice and haddocks; 18th to 

 21st, dog fish ; 22nd, cod ; 23rd, cod and dog 

 fish; 25th, dog fish; 26th, haddocks; 27th, 

 skate ; 28th and 29th, haddocks ; and on the 

 30th, turbots and brills — plaice cnly twice 

 during that month. February 1st, dog fish ; 

 2nd and 3rd, cod ; on the 4th we were closed ; 

 5 th, whiting; 6 th, dog fish; 8th, dog fish; 9th, 

 turbots and brills; 10th, Ostend plaice; 11th 

 haddocks; 12th, megrims; 13th, cod and skate; 

 15th, cod; 16th, large Aberdeen plaice; I'lth, 

 large Aberdeen plaice ; 18th, cod ; 19th, plaice ; 

 20th and 22nd, dog fish ; 23rd and 24th, Iceland 

 plaice ; 25th, plaice ; 26th, dog fish ; 27th, skate ; 

 29th, cod ; plaice five times during the month of 

 February, making seven times during those two 

 months we were able t'.) purchase plaice. 



2393. Then they come into your shop as dogs ; 

 what do you put them on the table as ? — We do 

 not sell them as dogs ; we skin them and sell them 

 as all sorts of fish-eels. One of my customers 

 said the other night : " You have some sturgeons, 

 have you ? " I said " Yes, sturgeons " ; he said, 

 " I will have some of those young sturgeons." 

 We cannot sell them as dogs, the same as with 

 cat fish, but of course the people do not like these 

 fish ; they might eat them once or twice, 

 but they soon sicken of them. The one popular 

 thing is plaice, and if we cannot get plaice our 

 trade is anyhow. 



Chairman. 



2394. How much meat is there on a 10 inch 

 plaice ? — Very little. I should think if you take 

 the flesh from the bone it would not weigh more 

 than half an ounce. 



Duke of Ahercom. 



2395. How many years ago did the diminution 

 begin to take place in plaice ? — I should think 

 we might go back twenty years. 



Lord Tweedm,outh. 



2396. You buy these fish at Billingsgate every 

 morning ? — Yes. 



2397. And I suppose it depends very much 

 on the price of the particular fish what you give 

 your customers ? — Yes, we can only make a 

 certain amount out of it. 



2398, You 



