INVESTIGATION OF THE FUE-SEAL INDUSTRY OF ALASKA. 289 



The above amounts were paid to parties named by certificate of the Secretary of 

 State on the Secretary of the Treasury, as per form herewith, in accordance with the 

 provisions of the act of February 26. IS96. 



Bureau of Accounts, May 28, ] 912. W. AF. 



LIEBES KNOWINGLY VIOLATES HIS CONTRACT IN RE OWNERSHIP OF 



SAID " JAMES HAMILTON LEWIS." 



The Chairman. Ts it not a fact that when you signed the lease and gave bonds for 

 its faithful observance, March 12, 1890. a pelagic hunting schooner, owned by your 

 fellow lessee, Herman Liebes. was then at work hunting for seals at sea? 



Mr. Liebes. I had no knowledge of it. 



The Chairman. You say you have no knowledge of it? 



Mr. Liebes. 1 say if such was the case, I had no knowledge of it.. 



The Chairman. Is it not a fact that the James Hamilton Lewis, the ownership of 

 which was vested in Herman Liebes, had cleared, on or before March, 1890, from San 

 Francisco, bound for hunting fur seals at sea? 



Mr. Liebes. Ihave no recollection of that at all, sir. 



The Chairman. Is it not a fact that at the close of the season of 1890 the aforesaid 

 James Hamilton Lewis had taken some 1,471 fur-seal skins at sea, or more of them? 



Mr. Liebes. I have no knowledge of it. 



The Chairman. Do you mean to say, Mr. Liebes, that they did or did not, or that 

 you don't know anything about it? 



Mr. Liebes. J don't know anything about it. 



The Chairman. la it not a fact that on or about August 1 , 1890, the James Hamilton 

 Lewis raided the fur-seal rookeries on Copper Island (Commander or Russian Islands), 

 was fired on, two men badly wounded, but managed to escape capture? (P. 887.) 



Mr. Liebes. Ihave no knowledge of that. 



The Chairman. Is it not a fact that on September 17, 1890, you, Isaac Liebes, presi- 

 dent of the Xorth American Commercial Co., became a part owner of the James Hamil- 

 ton Lewis? 



Mr. Liebes. I don't know anything about it. (P. 886, Hearing No. 13.) 



The Chairman. Did you know when you read the Windom lease that he had bound 

 you in its terms not to engage in pelagic sealing, on the pain of penalties and the for- 

 feiture of your lease and bonds if you did? 



Mr. Liebes. Ihave never seen such a lease that Iknow of. 



The Chairman. Did Secretary Windom modify or change his draft of the new lease 

 of May 1, 1890-May 1, 1910, in the least when you accepted and signed it March 12, 

 1890? 



Mr. Liebes. That is a matter that I do not know anything about. (P. 887, Hearing 

 No. 13, June 20, 1912.) 



The Chairman. Is it not a fact that when you signed the lease and gave bonds for its 

 faithful observance, March 12, 1890, a pelagic hunting schooner, owned by your fellow 

 lessee, Herman Liebes, was then at work hunting for seals at sea? 



Mr. Liebes. I had no knowledge of it. 



The Chairman. You say you have no knowledge of it? 



Mr. Liebes. I say if such was the case, I had no knowledge of it. 



The Chairman. Is it not a fact that the James Hamilton Lewis, the ownership of 

 which was vested in Herman Liebes, had cleared, on or before March, 1890, from San 

 Francisco, bound for hunting fur seals at sea? 



Mr. Liebes. I have no recollection of that at all, sir. 



The Chairman. Is it not a fact that at the close of the season of 1890 the aforesaid 

 James Hamilton Lewis had taken some 1,471 fur-seal skins at sea, or more of them? 



Mr. Liebes. I have no knowledge of it. 



The Chairman. Do you mean to say, Mr. Liebes, that they did or did not, or that 

 you don't know anything about it? 



Mr. Liebes. I don't know anything about it. (P. 887, Hearing No. 13, June 20, 

 1912.) 



The Chairman. Is it not a fact that on or about August 1, 1890, the James Hamilton 

 Lewis raided the fur-seal rookeries on Copper Island (Commander or Russian Islands), 

 was fired on, two men badly wounded, but managed to escape capture? 



Mr. Liebes. I have no knowledge of that. 



The Chairman. Is it not a fact that on September 17, 1890, you, Isaac Liebes, presi- 

 dent of the North American Commercial Co., became a part owner of the James Harr 

 ilton Lewis? 



Mr. Liebes. I don't know anything about it. 



53490—14 19 



