FOREST AND STREAM. 



406 



Sharps' aSD Kigby — A. Challenge Aock.ptjjd.- -In the Vol 

 : o! Dec. 8th appears a letter from Mr 

 John Rigby, with the following paragraph : "To bring the 

 matter to an issue ; I am ready to arrange a match at 1,000 

 yards between two men shooting with muzzle-loaders, and 

 two men with American breech-loaders, the latter to clean at 

 MJeir discretion ; but the prize to be awarded to the squad 

 making the best score in a given time." 



We have authority to state that Mr. John Eigby's offer has 

 been accepted by tbc Sharps' Rifle Company. To-day's mail 

 will carry a proposition to Mr. Rigby which, as it is pretty 

 liberal in its character, we hope will be accepted. It remains 

 OH Mr. Rigby's part of course to agree to the terms. Later we 

 will give' publicity to the detail?, which we for the present 

 retain. 



Yoekville Rifle OfcUB. — The following made on average 

 of inners (3) or more in the third competition for the Y. R. C 

 champion badge of the Yorkville Rifle Club, held at Washing- 

 ton Park, Dec. 25th. Mr. J. L. Paulding won the badge for 

 the first time. 



JLT>auluing, Pea Mart.. 4 4443 8 53443553 5-59 



A Smart Sti Spor i i 2 4 3642444445 5—58 



J J Keillv, WinohSpor 4 4 4 3 5 4 4 4 5 4 4 3 4 4—56 



WJDutf. Sll Spur 4 4 -1 4 8 4 3 4 3 3 2 3 3 4 4-52 



J R Smith, ShSpor 4 8 4 2 3 4 3 4 4 4 4 4 4 3 0—50 



6 See, Rem Mil 4S434S04244404 4—46 



At 100 yds. reduced Creedmoor target. 



Glen Drake. — The American Rifle Association opened 

 Glen Drake Range, at Pelhamville, Westchester county on 

 Christmas Day, to the public, with subscription matches and 

 one all-comers' match, each 200 yards. Winners : 1st, Col. 

 John T. Underbill, 19; Ma]. G. W. Coburn, 19; John Wil- 

 son, 19. Second, Col. TJhderhill, 20 ; Major Coburn, 20. 

 Thud, Major Coburn, 27. 



Milwaukee, Dec. 19. — Several shots at 000 yard were 

 made when it was hardly possible to see the target. The 

 members were pleased to welcome Mr. Johu Meunier on 

 the range, who, in a few shots, showed that he could make 

 bull's-eyes as well as ever, notwithstanding the loss of one 

 eye. The scores were as follows— fifteen shots at 800 and 

 thirteen at 900 yards : 



"David Hill i m 553 4554 6545 545 4-68?,-, 



.Davullllll -j 900 5 5 B 5 4 5 5 3 4 5 5 5 — 50 j 1M 



W T TVralre P 60 3 5 4 4 IT 4 3 5 5 5 4 4 5 4 5-65 I m 



murage < g()0 55503545555453 _s 4 j- 11J 



WWPldinir < 80 ° 5555555405 3 54 5-61) ,.,.. 



T P WPllPr 5 800 434555054 3 45 44 5-60 I , Q4 



JCWellei | 900 3 3 3 3 555424034 —14 f Wi 



T Tnhncfnn V 800 4 5 5 5 3 4 5 5 5 5 5 5 5 5 5-71 \ .„, 



JJoliDbton } 900 g 523S45 545555 -545 



—We are pleased to announce that through their secretary, 

 P. H. Jacobi, Esq., the Jersey Schutzen Corps will partici- 

 pate in the Forest and Stream and Rod and Gun match 

 for a gold medal to be shot for on the 23d January, 1878. 



—We acknowledge the receipt of the report issued by 

 Colonel G. W. Wingate, General Inspector of Rifle Practice, 

 and General John B. Woodward, Inspector-General of Rifle 

 Practice by the National Guard of the State of New York. 

 The present crowded condition of our columns prevents our 

 giving an analysis of this interesting repoi t, which we trust 

 will receive ample justice in our next issue. 



RECOIL AND UPSET OF BULLETS. 



Nkwark, N J., Deo. 4, 18TI. 

 In your issue of July 5 we wore allowed the honor of presenting to the 

 numerous readers of the Forest and Stream the subject of recoil, 

 wherein we took the grounds that the real recoil in a gun did not take 

 place unt ; l after the missile had escaped from it. Our claim wa» that 

 the expanding column of gas forcing itself on the external air, and not 

 directly the missile, produced the recoil ; but it was admitted that the 

 missile was a factor, in as much as the weight and retarding influences 

 of the missile increased the density and consequently the power of the 

 gas to produce recoil when the real object of resistance— external air— 

 is met. We did not claim that the gun ivas always absolutely motion- 

 less while the missile was in transit through the gun, but that the slight 

 pressure backward was to be ascribed to the advancing column of air 

 preceding the missile, which was a sort of prelude recoU produced on 

 the same principal as the unalancl more 'powerful recoU caused by the 

 contact of the powder gases from behind the missUe with the external 

 air. Our theory was favored by some and opposed by others, both pub- 

 licly and privately ; hence it becomes us to stand in our proper light 

 and show those that take the negative position the errors of their argu- 

 ment. 



' Two or three opposing notices, robbed of their garbled quolations and 

 reflections, present their points in a comprehensive manner, but to re- 

 move their underpinning and let their fabric fall will show the weakness 

 of other like structures. J.F. P. in the Forest and Stream of July 26, 

 18TT, presents the following: "If an individual stand on a skiff on 

 water and push against another vessel of like weight and like size the 

 force will be equalized and both vessels will move from each other ex- 

 actly the same distance aud at the same rate of motion ; but if the ves- 

 sel on which you stand be four times the weight of the one yon are 

 pushing you will only move about one-fourth as far as the other." This 

 ia a scientific fact showing the influence of one body upon another 1 

 when separated by expansive force (action and reaction), which was 

 most beautifully and mathematically illustrated by D. D. who very ap- 

 propriately presents the subject by the introduction of a gun, as fol- 

 lows : " If a gun thirty-two inches long weighing ten pounds discharges 

 a missile weighing one ounce at 1,600 feet in one second, while the mis- 

 sile is passing the gun, the gun will recoil one-fifth of an inch." This, 

 also, would be true providUig the gun and missile were separated when 

 the expansive force was applied, but they are not, and neither of these 

 illustrations any more represent the action of a missile In its transit 

 tlirough a gun than would standing on one's head. In order for both 

 bodieB to be thus separated by expansive force they must be both sub- 

 ject alike to the same elements of friction. Is the missile, while drag- 

 ging on the inner walls of the gun, thus subject to the same elements 

 of friction as the gun itself ? We will see! We wiUtake J. F. P's 

 " Skitf on water" and call it a gun, and lay him on the b nttom of it at 

 the stern (bush pin) and oall him the missile, a pole or any other agent 

 with which he can apply expansive force we will call the powder. 

 Now, while lying in this position.let him apply to the breech pin (stern) 

 the expansive foree (powder) and force himself to the fore (muzzle),and 



if he cm force the ski ir bauk fairly one fraction of a hair he can lift 

 Ifbyl tie waistbands of his pantaloons. For D. D. I would sns- 

 yt'Liil two platforms by a cord at each end of equal weight, so that they 

 v; mi id touch on one. I would place a large gun of some light material, 

 bin, that would be just equal to D. B's weight, twice his length and 

 would admit him lu person. The muzzle of thisguul would have 

 placed even with aud looking out upon the contiguous platform. Into 

 this guu, down to the breech, we would have D. D. place himself, and 

 by any sort of expansive force appUed to the breech he maybe pleased 

 louse, he wili force himself to the muzzle. During this process he 

 will not move the gun back, but on the force being continued amdhe 

 being landed on the contiguous platform, the two platforms will be sep- 

 arated just equally. This experiment clears up two points. First, it 

 shows that the philosophy by which bodies are separated by expansive 

 force is not applicable to the transit of a missile through a guu. Sec- 

 ond, that even though the missile is half the weight of the gun the gun 

 is not forced back while.the missile is in transit. Neither would it if it- 

 were possible for the disparity, if the missile weighed a ton and the 

 gun but a pound. 



In Forest and Stream of Xov. 29 will be found some excellent re- 

 marks by Geo. H. Ferris upon the merits of breech and muzzle-loaders 

 and the upset of bullets. In his reference to my contribution to F. and 

 3., published a few weeks since, as follows: " ' Straight-bore' gives 

 the idea that the upsetting of buUets is of recent discovery," is a mis- 

 conception, it is true 1 that bullets were known to expand in the 

 breech of the gun twenty-five years ago, but did they recognize the fact 

 that bullets also encountered .a force in front that mashed them as if 

 pressed between the cushioned jaws of a vise ? The force in front was 

 our principal point, since the foice behind was well enough understood. 



In articles to Rod and Gun, and finally Io^Fokest and Stream and 

 Rod and Got, I had represented this force (air pack) which had been 

 responded to and questioned by men of apparent reading and intelli- 

 gence, which led me to question whether the fact had been previously 

 noted, since I myseU had not seen anything printed, or heard anything 

 said upon the subject before being introduced by myself. 



When I first introduced this subject of "air pack" I had reached 

 the fact through abstract reasoning upon the forces at play in the firing 

 of a gun ; but I was so thoroughly convinced that such a. force was 

 present that to convince others I, through a rifle-shooting and a rule- 

 making friend, had instituted a series of experiments. 



The first experiments were with lead conoids of 230 grains, solid hee 

 muzzle-loading rifle. The experiments were commenced with small 

 charges of powder which did not mash the missiles, and the powder in- 

 creased until the upsetting was manifest, when the charge of powder 

 was noted. The powder was increased until the missiles were mashed 

 like putty at the front. The heels of the missiles show but HI tie if any 

 evidence of violence when compared with those that had not been fired. 

 To prove the fact still further, the same experiment was gone through 

 with Creedmoor missiles containing 1-32 tin. 



In order to separate the upset in front and the upset at the heel of the 

 missile the inner chamber at the heel had inserted In it a snugly-flt- 

 tiug piece of hard wood. As soon as these missiles began to upset 

 (mash) there was a neck formed in the missile exactly corresponding 

 to the wooden plug effectually separating the two forces, viz : the up- 

 setting force behind, from the powder, and the upsetting force in front 

 from the air pack, or consolidated air in the gun. Mr. Ferris calls this 

 air pack " reaction." I don'tobject to the term so long as he recognizes 

 the cause— air pack. 



A bullet could be upset by a blow from some solid agent with no other 

 resistance than Its own inertia, but this is not the case in the gun, but 

 is upset from an accumulated force In front which may be proved by 

 his own experiments. A force that upsets a missile in a pistol barrel 

 will surely upset one in a rifle barrel, but a force that will upset one in 

 a rifle barrel may not upset one in a pistol. 



Some fine quick specimens of powder will burn up in a barrel two or 

 three inches long, while other sorts, slow, would require a barrel per- 

 haps tw r o and even three feet long to consume it, and yet, in the proper 

 length of guu, would make good shooting, luo grains of gunpowder 

 yield about T5.59 cubic inches of gases, and a gun barrel with a greater 

 capacity than that will never discharge the missile with that amount of 

 powder ; and where the powder is fine and sudden in its explosion it 

 will expend a large proportion of its force on the walls of the gun, on 

 the missile, and in accumulating resistance by packing the air in front; 

 consequently it is a failure in shooting except in pistols, and as ahown 

 by Mr. Ferris it may be made too quick for them even. 



There was only a little hair standing up between Mr. Ferris and my- 

 self, that was hardly worth spliting, and what I have written has been 

 more in a spirit to call attention and add testimony to the excellence of 

 his paper than otherwise. Straight-Bore. 



THE SCHOVERLING & DALY GOLD 

 BADGE. 



New York, Nov., 1STT. 

 Editor Forest and Stream: 



We i'eel convinced that the attention of rifle experts, and those who 

 wish to learn how to shoot the rifle, should be called to the benefit to 

 be derived lroin practice with .22-cal. rifles. Such rifles are made quite 

 as carefully and accurately as any short or long range rifle. At this 

 season, in most sections, out-doorshooting cannot be carried on, and 

 the practice necessary to enable the marksman to enter the field in 

 the spring with more skill and precision than when he left it in the 

 fall, can only be had with perfect shootiDg during the winter with a 

 .22-cal. ride. There are thousands of young men likely to swell the 

 number of rifle Ehots, who are deterred by the expen;e and time 

 attending a long practice necesssary to qualify them to enter matches, 

 on account of the high cost target rifles. A few months' practice 

 at reduced targets, with 3 lb. pull rifles, will enable any one who has 

 the possibilities of a good shot in him, to enter at once in the spring 

 into the ranks of the off-hand shots. 



Our Ballard Gallery Kifle is a really psrfect shooting .22-cal. Mr.. J. 

 S. Conlin, who has given more attention to gallery shooting and spent 

 more money to get perfect shooting rifles than almost any other 

 person uses the Ballard gallery rifle, and the good shooting of this rifle 

 is corroborated by hundreds of the best shots. 



What we would suggest is that in places where there are no 100- 

 feet galleries, that clubs shall build them and keep them open after- 

 noons'and evenings for practice and weekly matches; also, that new 

 clubs be formed who should patronize existing galleries or furnish 

 their own rifles. This communication was suggested by the formation, 

 a few weeks ago, of the Sew York Kifle Club for off-hand shooting, of 

 which Mr. Chas. B. Biydenburg, the well known rifleman, ia the lead- 

 ing spirit. This club, which will no doubt take a front rank among off- 

 hand clubs, has weekly matches of different kinds at Conlin's Gal- 

 lery. The interest in the off-hand shooting, it is true, is increasing 

 very rapidly, and the advantage of such practice is commencing to be 

 better understood. 



In order to bring this matter before riflemen, we will offer a gold 

 badge, to be shot for with .22-cal. rifles at 200-yard targets, reduced to 

 100-feet, Creedmoor rules, on a certain evening all over the United 

 States and Canada. As there may be some difficulties in having 

 proper rules for determining scores, we should be glad to have 

 the suggestions or the readers of the Forests and Stream in regard to 

 the match. Schovbrlixg & Daly, 



84 and so Chambers Btreet, New York, 



MUZZLE-LOADERS VERSUS BREECH- 

 LOADERS. 



SxuAousE, N. Y., Dec. 10, 1877. 

 Editor Forest akd Stream: 



Dear Sir— In your issue of Nov. 29 I read with much satisfac- 

 tion an article from the pen of Mr. Geo. H. Eerriss, of TJtiea, N. 

 Y.,on the "Upset of Bullets," wherein he discussed at some 

 length the relative merits of breech and muzzle-loading rifles. 

 To the factB and opinions therein contained I shall not allude ex- 

 cept to approve, for tHe points that he touched upon he touched 

 with a niatster-hand. I shonld have been pleased had he gone 

 more into detail and given some of the reasons for the wide- 

 spread and growing popularity of breech-loading guns, as com- 

 pared with that of muzzle-loaders. 



First, they are generally manufactured by large companies, 

 who can afford to keep men lying around rifle ranges to become 

 experts in the use of their guns, and thereby make a reputation 

 for them. Second, they are more convenient, and, having their 

 ammunition already prepared by skillful hands, they are preferred 

 by a class of men who shoot for pastimfi, aud who, being able ex- 

 perts with the pen, like to make a record of their achievements. 

 There is also a class of men who contribute to their popularity in 

 another way, and whose positions are well defined in the follow- 

 ing extracts from Col. Peel's report to the N. E. A. of Great 

 Britain, of the international match at Creedmoor. After express- 

 ing his belief in the superiority of the breech-loader, he says ; 

 " To the gunmakera I would say, JDo not stop to discuss the 

 merits of your respective muzzle-loaders, but go with the times, 

 and do not rest satisfied till you have produced a practical breech- 

 loading rifle that will beat all the muzzle-loaders and breeeh 

 loaders ever yet made.'' To the council of the N. B. A. I would 

 say, " Whether you wish to encourage team shooting or not, hold 

 out every inducement to the production of the best breech-loading 

 rifles." And, still further : "Above all, set your face against the 

 further use of muzzle-loaders, even if proved to be better for 

 match purposes than our present breech-loaders. The former 

 are relics of a by-gone age, and the chief obstacle to all improve- 

 ment in a practical direction." This sufficiently shows the bias of 

 the writer, and there are many like him who have a lingering 

 distrust that the muzzle-loader may be the bettor gun for accurate 

 shooting ; but it is old now, and therefore it must be kicked out of 

 the way to make room for their new-born pets. 



I freely accord to them the right to advocate the claims of the 

 breech-loader, but in all fairness they should rest them on their 

 actual merits, and not claim for them a superiority of shooting 

 qualities which has not yet been established by any proper test. 

 Many persons who would otherwise prefer the muzzle-loader have 

 been mislead by this system of puffing and forcing the claims of 

 the breech-loader, and have adopted it under the mistaken im- 

 pression that it was best for long-range shooting. I freely admit 

 that the best breech-loading rifles (with the ammunition as pre- 

 nared for them by the makers) will beat the majority of muzzle- 

 loaders at long-ranges. This is not because they are loaded at the 

 breech, but is entirely due to the length and form of the bullet, 

 and the manner of patcliing it, provided always, that the twist of 

 the gun is sufficient to handle such projectile properly. The 

 secret of their supposed superiority over the muzzle-loader lies 

 iu the fact that they shoot a cylindrical or bolt-shaped bullet of 

 great length, as compared with the conical ones generally used in 

 muzzle-loading guns. These bolts being much heavier than a 

 conical bullet of the same length, and not encountering any more 

 resistance from the atmosphere iu their flight through it, it fol- 

 lows that if discharged from tho gun at the same velocity, they 

 will retain that velocity longer, or, in other words, have greater 

 force toward the last end of a long flight. Heretofore it has been 

 the common practice with the best muzzle-loading rifles to patch 

 the balls with a round patch of sufficient size to cover the ball 

 from one-quarter to three-eighths of an inch in length, according 

 to size of calibre. This necessitates tho use of a comparatively 

 short bullet, because if a long one be used you must increase 

 the length of bearing proportionately, in order to insure steadi- 

 ness while being discharged from the gun . If the round patch is 

 cut large enough to cover a longer- bearing on the bullet, there 

 will be so much oloth that the wrinkles or folds in it cannot be 

 properly adjusted to the grooves in the gun. Hence, a very long 

 bullet cannot (with a round patch) be properly fitted to the gun, 

 and consequently cannot be made to shoot well at any distance. 

 This difficulty is now happily overcome in the Warner muzzle- 

 loading rifle, manufactured by Nichols & Lefever, ot Syracuse, N. 

 Y. They have a style of muzzling their guns and cutting the 

 patches, which enables them to fit a bullet perfectly to the gun 

 with any desired length of hearing. This enables them to shoot 

 a ball as long and as cylindrical in form as any breech-loader can 

 shoot. Their bullets are made in two parts and swaged together ; 

 the butt end of soft lead to fill the grooves of the gun, and the 

 front end of a compound of lead and antimony, bo hard that the 

 action of the powder will not upset it. These bulletB, in loading, 

 are forced into the guu with a guide starter, which fits them per- 

 fectly to the gun, with the point true to its centre; and as their 

 form is not changed by the force of the powder in being discharged 

 from the gun, they are delivered from it with less friction, greater 

 force and more uniformity than can be attained by any bullet de- 

 pendent upon the action of the powder to fit it to the gun, as is 

 the case with all breech-loaders. I quite agree with Mi - . Eerrisa 

 that there has been no satisfactory test in this country as to the 

 relative merits of breech-loading guns, and what we call proper 

 muzzle-loaders. Further, I do not believe that the makers or ad- 

 vocates of breech-loading guns desire to make any Buch test. If 

 any of them do, and wish to make it in a manner that shall be de- 

 cisive, they can find an opportunity to do so by addressing 



Muzzle-Loader, 

 Care of Windsor House, Syracuse, N. Y. 



[We give our correspondent, "Muzzle-Loader," full space 

 to promulgate his views, and it is but fair that we should do 

 so, for it must be remembered that a great many sensible peo- 

 ple in England, Ireland and Scotland still believe that muzzle 

 loading rifles are better than breech-loaders. Out own opin- 

 ion we have stated innumerable times. Will any of our 

 breech-loading manufacturers take up " Muzzle-Loader's " 

 challenge of battle ?— Ed.] 



